Daylilies forum: The seed is not dry..

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Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
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cybersix
Aug 11, 2015 1:52 AM CST
Hi everyone, the only seed I collected until now is not really dry. It stayed in open air fro three days, I gently pinched it and my nail leaves a sign in it. Is it too early to put in the fridge? Should I wait more?
Many thanks!
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallisblog.com
Name: Mayo
The Netherlands, Europe (Zone 9a)
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Mayo62
Aug 11, 2015 3:32 AM CST
hi Sabrina,

all the seeds I bought on Lilt Auction were air dried for 48 hours and than put in the fridge (by the seller). Big Grin

When they arrived here they were not DRY-dry:
if I leave the plastic baggy with them in the sun for 10 minutes, the inside of the baggy fogs up with moisture.

So I think drying them for 3 days would be enough, but perhaps you should get some advice from the pro's Thumbs up


Mayo
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Name: Fred Manning
Lillian Alabama

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spunky1
Aug 11, 2015 5:03 AM CST
Daylily seed will not be hard as a rock, they just need the pinch test, not the nail test. When I harvest seed I make sure they are dry by rolling them around on a dry bath towel, put them in a zip lock bag, (no drying time necessary) then into the fridge until I get ready to plant them.
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Aug 11, 2015 5:37 AM CST
It depends on what you want to do. To thoroughly air dry for dry storage (not necessarily in a fridge) can take two or three weeks but that should be indoors in something like an open paper bag or cup or something. I wouldn't do it in a plastic bag in the sun or the heat may kill the seeds.

Where things get complicated with daylily seeds is that some seeds have seed dormancy, which means they won't germinate immediately when planted in otherwise suitable germination conditions. This can happen with a percentage but not all seeds of a seed batch. There's no way of knowing before you start whether any given seed will have seed dormancy. What typically happens is that you plant the seeds, some come up almost right away and the others germinate spread out over weeks or months. If this happens then your seeds have seed dormancy.

To get around it, if this happens and you don't want to just wait it out, you can stratify (damp chill) your next batch of seeds in the fridge. This means the seeds must have sufficient internal moisture content for the chilling to break their dormancy and allow them to germinate promptly. We do this by adding some drops of water or a damp kitchen paper towel or coffee filter to the plastic bag or container with the seeds, or put the seeds into a damp medium such as vermiculite, sand, perlite in a bag/container and then refrigerate for about a month. Then, when you take the seeds out to plant them, they should germinate all together within a couple of weeks at room temperature.

We can get conflicting ideas on this because seed dormancy in daylilies is variable. It may be that the climate, the parents, the time of harvest, the time of sowing, the temperature or other factors influence whether an individual seed is going to have seed dormancy. Even an individual specific seed can be dormant at some times in its pre-germination life but not others, for example the dormancy may wear off in long term dry storage so the seed may be dormant if you start it soon after harvest but not if you've stored it for a longer period.

People with daylily seeds that don't have seed dormancy often do not believe stratification is beneficial Smiling . I didn't to start with - the first batch of daylily seeds I started in spring after months of dry storage at room temperature all germinated at over 90% within a couple of weeks of starting. So I decided to prove that they didn't need stratification to germinate that quickly. The next year I started several batches with and without damp chilling, but this time in autumn, and found that the ones started without it did germinate erratically over a long period of time while the stratified ones germinated all together within a week or two. The two main differences were time of year of starting and more warmth and sunlight on the windowsill for the spring started ones.

Where there's a grey area is refrigeration of seeds that have not been thoroughly dried down to the minimum moisture content needed for dry storage at room temperature. The question is do these seeds stratify because they still have enough moisture content, or did they not have any seed dormancy to begin with? Refrigeration of seeds that are thoroughly dried internally does not break seed dormancy, it is simply a way of storing them for longer.

This is getting kind of long and sounding more complicated than it is! The bottom line is that, if your seeds don't all germinate within a couple of weeks or so of starting, then stratification (damp chilling) in future should make this happen. If you don't mind waiting for the slow ones then you don't need to damp chill them. For the most part they will probably germinate anyway given enough time but this can be a long time. If you're trying to dry them for dry storage at room temperature and not stratifying it will likely take longer than a few days.




[Last edited by sooby - Aug 11, 2015 5:46 AM (+)]
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Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Aug 11, 2015 3:49 PM CST
Sooby so many thanks for your post, and many thanks to spunky amd mayo too. I want the seed (it's just one for now) to germinate as fast as it can, so can i stratify right now? I alway read a cold period it's needed.
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallisblog.com
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
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sooby
Aug 11, 2015 6:00 PM CST
Yes, you can stratify now. Some will germinate without a cold period but there's no way of knowing ahead of time. Since there's only one precious seed I would plant it in whatever you want to start growing it in (not too deep, about twice the depth of the seed is about right), then enclose the pot in a plastic bag and put the whole thing in the fridge for around a month. The media you use, vermiculite, perlite, seed starting mix or whatever, should be only as damp as you would make it for normally planting seeds, it should not be wet.

Then all you have to do is remove the pot from the fridge when the chilling time is up and wait for the seedling to appear. Then you can post a picture of it for us!
[Last edited by sooby - Aug 11, 2015 6:01 PM (+)]
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Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Aug 12, 2015 2:27 AM CST
Many thanks again! The bag must be sealed completely or there's the need to let air in and out? I have common garden soil, or kitchen paper.
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallisblog.com
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
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sooby
Aug 12, 2015 7:42 AM CST
Definitely not garden soil, it isn't suitable for starting seeds indoors or really for growing anything in a pot, so damp kitchen paper would be the better choice. The bag is just to stop the seed from drying out, so it doesn't need to be completely air tight, but should not be open enough to let in too much drying air from the refrigeration.
Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Aug 12, 2015 3:07 PM CST
I used damp kitchen paper in a ziplock bag. Now I guess I only have to wait. I saw a video on youtube, a woman let daylilies seeds (they were stella de oro seeds) in the fridge with a damp paper towel and almost all sprouted after a month. Who knows, maybe the one and only will germinate soon. nodding
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallisblog.com
Name: Sue
Ontario, Canada (Zone 4a)
Daylilies Birds Enjoys or suffers cold winters Native Plants and Wildflowers Butterflies Annuals
Region: Canadian Keeps Horses Dog Lover Plant Identifier Garden Sages
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sooby
Aug 12, 2015 3:53 PM CST
Too bad there's already a 'One and Only' registered! Hilarious! It's possible for them to germinate in the fridge but usually it is after they come out to room temperature. I suspect when they germinate in the fridge that they may not have been dormant to start with so the refrigeration was actually unnecessary, but I don't think anyone has researched that.
Name: Sabrina
Italy, Brescia (Zone 8b)
Love daylilies and making candles!
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Europe Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Level 1
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cybersix
Aug 12, 2015 4:16 PM CST
I was thinking the same, that in that case they don't need stratification. I will check the seed periodically. Oh yes too bad that one and only is registered lol!
Sabrina, North Italy
My blog: http://hemerocallisblog.com
Name: Becky
Sebastian, Florida (Zone 10a)
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beckygardener
Aug 12, 2015 4:36 PM CST
@cybersix and @mayo62 and any others outside of the US and Canada - Contact Maureen if you are interested in receiving some daylily seeds!!!

See this thread:
The thread "International Seed Bank" in Daylilies forum

You can contact Maureen Strong via email at:
international@daylilies.org

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[Last edited by beckygardener - Aug 12, 2015 4:37 PM (+)]
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