Plant Database forum: Ceropegia candelabrum

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Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
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greene
Oct 16, 2015 6:49 AM CST
Looking in the ATP database for Ceropegia candelabrum var. biflora...not there.

The Plant List:
Ceropegia candelabrum
C. candelabrum var. tuberosa
C. candelabrum subsp. tuberosa
C. candelabrum var. biflora
The Plant List tells me this is all one plant but it's dated 2012.

Is this one plant or two? Should there be one entry in the database or two?

Catalogue of life tells enough to confuse me...on the first try the word "biflora" is not listed.
Ceropegia candelabrum accepted name
with Infraspecific taxon:
C. candelabrum subsp. candelabrum
C. candelabrum subsp. tuberosa

By searching Catalogue of LIfe for simply "Ceropegia biflora" the answer comes up:
Species - C. biflora synonym for C. candelabrum subsp. tuberosa
Infraspecific taxon - C. candelabrum var. biflora synonym for C. candelabrum subsp. tuberosa

Sorry but my eyes crossed and my brain went dead trying to figure this out. *Blush* One word that confuses me is "infraspecific".

Is this all one plant? or two?
Thank You! I need a nap... Rolling on the floor laughing
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
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plantladylin
Oct 16, 2015 7:52 AM CST
This is what I found at the Catalogue of Life (as of September 28, 2015)

Ceropegia candelabriformis St. Lag. - Species synonym for Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. candelabrum St. Lag.

Ceropegia candelabrum - Species accepted name

Ceropegia candelabrum Lour. - Species synonym for Ceropegia loureiroi G. Don

Ceropegia candelabrum Roxb. - Species synonym for Ceropegia bulbosa Roxb.

Ceropegia candelabrum Thw. - Species synonym for Ceropegia intermedia Wight

Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. candelabrum - Infraspecific taxon - accepted name

Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa (Roxb.) H. Huber - Infraspecific taxon - accepted name

Ceropegia candelabrum var. biflora (L.) M.Y. Ansari - Infraspecific taxon - synonym for Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa (Roxb.) H. Huber

Ceropegia candelabrum var. tuberosa (Roxb.) N.P. Singh - Infraspecific taxon - ambiguous synonym for
Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa (Roxb.) H. Huber
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Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
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greene
Oct 16, 2015 8:05 AM CST
Thanks for trying, but that only adds to the headache. As far as I know...here in the ATP database we ignore the human names after the plant names; we don't include the Roxb. or the Wight, etc.

Is the C. candelabrum biflora the same as C. candelabrum? or are they two different plants

Its not easy to do this being dyslexic as it all looks the same to my eyes/brain.
(I need more coffee before I tackle this again. Rolling on the floor laughing )
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
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plantladylin
Oct 16, 2015 8:28 AM CST
C. candelabrum var. biflora appears to be a synonym for C. candelabrum subspecies tuberosa
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~
Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
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greene
Oct 16, 2015 8:44 AM CST
Thanks but if you'd please follow the breadcrumbs back to the question: are we talking about one plant or two? Our database currently has one. Are all the other names simply synonyms of the one? or is there a second plant?
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
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plantladylin
Oct 16, 2015 9:36 AM CST
Maybe @Calif_Sue, or @KentPfeiffer, or @zuzu can help clear up the confusion. I'm not certain but if I'm reading it correctly the ones below would be separate accepted named plants but I see that we only have the first one listed in our database:

Ceropegia candelabrum - Ceropegia (Ceropegia candelabrum)

Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. candelabrum

Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa

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Name: Kent Pfeiffer
Southeast Nebraska (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Plant Identifier Region: Nebraska Forum moderator
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KentPfeiffer
Oct 16, 2015 9:55 AM CST

Plants Admin

Ceropegia candelabrum var. biflora is a synonym for Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa.

Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa is not currently in the database, but it apparently should be.

The question of whether it is "one plant or two" is hard to answer because it implies a dichotomy that doesn't exist. There is one species, Ceropegia candelabrum, which itself is composed of two subspecies Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa and Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. candelabrum.

Or, at least that is the current thinking of the taxonomists who are experts on Ceropegias.
[Last edited by KentPfeiffer - Oct 16, 2015 9:57 AM (+)]
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Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
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greene
Oct 16, 2015 1:09 PM CST
Thumbs up That looks clear enough even for me to understand. Thank You!
If Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa were added to the ATP database, Ceropegia candelabrum var. biflora could be listed as the synonym. (I hope that is correct.)

I will now go look up dichotomy... *Blush* Sheesh, one word at a time, nice and slow...I will learn this stuff. Thumbs up
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Lin
Florida (Zone 9b)
Region: United States of America Morning Glories Region: Florida Houseplants Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database!
Garden Procrastinator Birds Butterflies Bee Lover Hummingbirder Container Gardener
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plantladylin
Oct 16, 2015 3:28 PM CST
Thumbs up greene Yep, that's correct it would be listed as a synonym for C. candelabrum subsp. tuberosa
~ Eat, Sleep .... Play in the dirt ~
Name: Greene
Savannah, GA (Sunset 28) (Zone 8b)
Rabbit Keeper Critters Allowed Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
Herbs Region: Georgia Region: United States of America Native Plants and Wildflowers Dog Lover Composter
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greene
Oct 16, 2015 4:17 PM CST
Guess I will trot on over to the Database Forum and request that the Ceropegia candelabrum subsp. tuberosa be added.... Thanks!
Sunset Zone 28, AHS Heat Zone 9, USDA zone 8b~~"Leaf of Faith"
Name: Zuzu
Northern California (Zone 9a)
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zuzu
Oct 16, 2015 5:23 PM CST

Plants Admin

I'll add the two subspecies, greene. Thank you.

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