Ask a Question forum: Please tell me what is happening here, please. Please... and please.

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Name: Brenden Reinhart
Flushing Michigan (Zone 6b)
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bhart90
Nov 23, 2015 9:37 PM CST
I started a bunch seeds from various places, mostly lemons, I believe I tried Cherry as well, can't think of any others at the moment.
THESE TWO have been like the pictures below, coming up on 2 months in 3 days. Not a single change.
I would LOVE to know what they are at this point, and why they are paused.
I repotted them 2 weeks ago, and the roots were fine, beautifully white.
The first picture is confusing me soo much, for it hasn't made any leaves persay, but simply is using it's shell? as leaves? if that makes any sense, I got noooo idea what is happening here, disregard the algae by the way.


The second picutres' leaves' are alsy dense if you can tell
PLEASE tell me what is going on

They are under my t5s like all of my other plants, I would love to know what they are and what is happeing
Thumb of 2015-11-24/bhart90/595f02


Thumb of 2015-11-24/bhart90/c29d55

Brenden
Name: Anne
Summerville, SC (Zone 8a)
Be a voice - not an echo!
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Xeramtheum
Nov 23, 2015 10:04 PM CST
When seeds first germinate they send up 'seed leaves' aka cotyledons. Cotyledons are kind of like the yolk of an egg .. it feeds the seedling and begins photosynthesis before the true leaves start to appear and in some cases can be rather thick. Usually the cotyledons don't look anything like the true leaves and will eventually fall off once true leaves start appearing.

The first picture might be the Cherry. The potting mix looks way too wet and are those round yellow things time release fertilizer? If it is, remove them and don't be feeding until at least 4 sets of true leaves are showing up. The 2nd picture looks like lemon. Both are wanting warmth and sun ... considering your zone they both have sorta gone dormant. Get the soil temperature in the upper 60's to low 70's to wake them up and as much direct sun as possible - also let the soil dry out a bit.
"We were all humans until race disconnected us, religion separated us, politics divided us and wealth classified us."

Unknown

Name: Brenden Reinhart
Flushing Michigan (Zone 6b)
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bhart90
Nov 23, 2015 10:26 PM CST
okie doke
Brenden
Name: David Laderoute
Zone 5B/6 - NW MO (Zone 5b)
Ignoring Zones altogether
Seed Starter Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 1
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DavidLMO
Nov 23, 2015 11:32 PM CST
The "shells" are the seed covers and can hang around and on the first leaves for months. They will fall off at some point.

What Xeramtheum said.

Also - there is no reason to repot a seedling until it is 3 - 4 inches tall - 2-3 at a minimum.

If you have a fan - run it.

If you have a heat mat, keep it on til you have 2 sets of true leaves.

Label everything!

Algae is an indication of too wet soil!! Sprinkle some cinnamon on it and it should kill it.

Grow seeds in seed staring media - not potting soil.

If you use humidity domes, remove them at this point.
Seeking Feng Shui with my plants since 1976
Name: Brenden Reinhart
Flushing Michigan (Zone 6b)
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bhart90
Nov 24, 2015 10:37 AM CST
DavidLMO said:The "shells" are the seed covers and can hang around and on the first leaves for months. They will fall off at some point.

What Xeramtheum said.

Also - there is no reason to repot a seedling until it is 3 - 4 inches tall - 2-3 at a minimum.

If you have a fan - run it.

If you have a heat mat, keep it on til you have 2 sets of true leaves.

Label everything!

Algae is an indication of too wet soil!! Sprinkle some cinnamon on it and it should kill it.

Grow seeds in seed staring media - not potting soil.

If you use humidity domes, remove them at this point.



Yes sir, thank you. Yea thinking about it, I don't know why I used ozmocote. Believe it or not, I do know better. Hahaha disgraceful! And I re potted it to see if it was actually alive, and just appearing to be color wise. Also, the roots on thee babies are literally the length of my middle finger, rediculous! And I will take dome off, ty you two
Brenden
Name: David Laderoute
Zone 5B/6 - NW MO (Zone 5b)
Ignoring Zones altogether
Seed Starter Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 1
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DavidLMO
Nov 24, 2015 10:48 AM CST
bhart90 said:I don't know why I used ozmocote. Believe it or not, I do know better. Hahaha disgraceful!


Don't worry about it - we all do silly things at times.

My point about repotting was twofold. First, some seed take a lonnnnnnnggggggggg time to germinate. If you go poking around, you run the risk of trashing germination. WRT potting up little guys - you run the risk of messing up the baby root system and killing the seedling.

The advice I give is based on been there done that - so again - don't worry. Just never do it again! Green Grin! Rolling my eyes.

Seeking Feng Shui with my plants since 1976
Name: Anne
Summerville, SC (Zone 8a)
Be a voice - not an echo!
Plant and/or Seed Trader Enjoys or suffers cold winters Hybridizer Birds Seed Starter Cat Lover
Pollen collector Morning Glories Greenhouse Bookworm Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages
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Xeramtheum
Nov 24, 2015 11:25 AM CST
Or we'll come by and beat you with tuna fish.
"We were all humans until race disconnected us, religion separated us, politics divided us and wealth classified us."

Unknown

Name: Rick Corey
Everett WA 98204 (Zone 8a)
Sunset Zone 5. Koppen Csb. Eco 2f
I helped beta test the first seed swap Plant and/or Seed Trader Seed Starter Region: Pacific Northwest Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Vegetable Grower
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member
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RickCorey
Nov 24, 2015 12:34 PM CST
Once you get the soil dry enough that watering will do no harm, consider watering for a week or two with dilute hydrogen peroxide, "just because". It might knock down the algae a little, and it might discourage any mold who are thinking they feel right at home in that wet, under-aerated soil.

BTW, if you have soil that is much too water-retentive, and don't want repot (*) again right away, you can remove some of the excess water with a wick, if the soil in the pot presses against the holes in the bottom of the pot.

Find a water-wicking fabric that is thick and fuzzy, like cotton flannel or toweling.

If the soilless mix doesn't touch the towel, put a cotton ball or two into some of the pot's holes, to make wicking contact between the soil in the pot and the flannel outside.

Set the pot on top of the flannel so that there is a continuous path from the soil, through a cotton ball if necessary, to the fabric outside the pot. Capillary action will assure that the wick is as wet as the soil in the bottom of the pot, right next to the holes.

Maybe you can just splay the wicking fabric around the saucer the plant sits in, and rely on evaporation to pull excess water out of the pot.

Maybe you have to set the pot somewhere the wick can dangle down into some other saucer or pot, and wick water out of the pot by capillary action PLUS gravity. This "dangling wick" makes the soil column act as if the pot were tall enough to stretch from the lowest edge of the dangling wick to the soil surface. Any "perched water" remaining will be in the towel, hanging below the pot, not in the pot drowning the roots.

With an effective dangling wick, you can get away with a too-water-retentive soil mix, OR over-watering. I don't think anything can save a plant if it has BOTH water-retentive soil AND over-watering!

When you pull the excess water out, air will rush in to fill the voids in the soil. Once they are air-filled instead of water-filled, gas exchange will speed up 10,000-fold and the roots will be that much happier. (**)

{Edited to change "100-fold" to "10,000-fold" after I looked it up in Wikipedia.)

http://garden.org/ideas/view/RickCorey/646/Bottom-Watering-S...

(*)
Re-potting includes knocking most of the old, soggy soil off the roots and replacing it with a different, faster-draining mix. If you have much root-rot going on, that soil will fall off easily.

"Potting up" is just moving a root ball to a bigger pot.


(**)
"Typically, a compound's diffusion coefficient is ~10,000× as great in air as in water."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_diffusivity


and:
"Effective diffusivity in porous media:

The effective diffusion coefficient describes diffusion through the pore space of porous media.[6] It is macroscopic in nature, because it is not individual pores but the entire pore space that needs to be considered. The effective diffusion coefficient for transport through the pores, De, is estimated as follows:

Effective diffusivity De = ( D x εt x δ ) / τ

where

D is the diffusion coefficient in gas or liquid filling the pores (m2s−1)
εt is the porosity available for the transport (dimensionless)
δ is the constrictivity (dimensionless)
τ is the tortuosity (dimensionless)

(I love the variable names "tortuosity " and "constrictivity".)

"The transport-available porosity equals the total porosity less the pores which, due to their size, are not accessible to the diffusing particles, and less dead-end and blind pores (i.e., pores without being connected to the rest of the pore system).

The constrictivity describes the slowing down of diffusion by increasing the viscosity in narrow pores as a result of greater proximity to the average pore wall. It is a function of pore diameter and the size of the diffusing particles."
[Last edited by RickCorey - Nov 25, 2015 12:03 PM (+)]
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Name: David Laderoute
Zone 5B/6 - NW MO (Zone 5b)
Ignoring Zones altogether
Seed Starter Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 1
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DavidLMO
Nov 24, 2015 1:00 PM CST
Some excellent advice Rick!!
Seeking Feng Shui with my plants since 1976
Name: Rick Corey
Everett WA 98204 (Zone 8a)
Sunset Zone 5. Koppen Csb. Eco 2f
I helped beta test the first seed swap Plant and/or Seed Trader Seed Starter Region: Pacific Northwest Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Vegetable Grower
Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Master Level Garden Sages I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I helped plan and beta test the plant database. Charter ATP Member
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RickCorey
Nov 24, 2015 1:35 PM CST
Thank You!

Al always tells me "It would be better to use a fast-draining mix to start with, rather than playing games with wicks!"

But hindsight is always 20-20.

(I forgot to stress the easiest method. Plop the pot down on a big, fat, fluffy towel and then replace the towel when sopping. Then water much less in the future.)

Name: Caroline
Oregon
Keeper of Poultry Spiders! Herbs Bee Lover Farmer Ferns
Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Region: Oregon Dog Lover Birds Cat Lover Critters Allowed
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JuniperVenus
Dec 29, 2015 8:54 PM CST
I'm no expert, but I wonder if it's rotting. It's common for seedlings to rot, and it looks a little like mold.
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