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Dec 3, 2018 4:30 PM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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But farmer's are the ones who work with Mother Nature. They should have some sort of overview. Not the modern, narrow minded $ approach. Farmer's do not pay a lot in taxes on their land.
Last edited by gasrocks Dec 3, 2018 4:36 PM Icon for preview
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Dec 3, 2018 4:30 PM CST
Name: Betty
MN zone 4b
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I can tell no farmers are here, it is a struggle to survive with farming as your income. While we do not farm we have family members that do, while also holding down other jobs in order make ends meet. The hours are long and the work hard plus you at the mercy of mother nature as to if you end up with decent crops. The costs of farming are huge, land, equipment, fuel costs, taxes, fertilizers, fixing equipment that breaks and much more. You can't blame a farmer for using as much of his land as possible it is certainly not based on greed.
If you want to be happy for a lifetime plant a garden!
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Betty MN Zone4 AHS member

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Dec 3, 2018 7:56 PM CST
Name: Ginny G
Central Iowa (Zone 5a)
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Dec 4, 2018 12:43 AM CST
Name: Dr. Demento Jr.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
daylilydreams said:I can tell no farmers are here, it is a struggle to survive with farming as your income. While we do not farm we have family members that do, while also holding down other jobs in order make ends meet. The hours are long and the work hard plus you at the mercy of mother nature as to if you end up with decent crops. The costs of farming are huge, land, equipment, fuel costs, taxes, fertilizers, fixing equipment that breaks and much more. You can't blame a farmer for using as much of his land as possible it is certainly not based on greed.

By the early nineties, some farms here the black top soil was gone to the point the yellow clay underneath was exposed.
St. Cloud had rapid expansion back then, in former prime farming area, and some regional farmers were paying to have the top soil removed for construction hauled out to put on the hill tops that were laid bare..
Some were smart or rich enough they also removed the clay top down several feet , spreading that over a broad area and then had the hill replaced at in a lower form with the top soil from the construction area.
Sharon and I hauled several yards to our garden in our trailer, shoveled by hand.
That cost money but then the gov. alcohol subsidy hit at that time so with the huge increase in the price for corn, for a decade they had a sudden cash flow.
Next time there will be no gov. windfall to help them out and the soil will still be gone.

Addendum:
The soil loss was so bad, back then, that what few snow banks we had from the rare snow storm, were black from the dirt blown off of the fields.
The road visibility was so bad some days, you had to turn your headlights on in that area, and even then you could not see an approaching car fifty yards away in broad daylight.
Those years were dry enough that hundreds, probably thousands of acres had corn the blue-grey color of death by July.
Only good thing was the dead corn, stopped the soil from blowing in the summer.
Rivers, in Minn. were low enough the State Gov. banned irrigation from lakes and streams, and some had their wells go dry.
If those days return, and I would not bet against it, those fools who removed the hedge rows earned their misery.
Many have done it because with the huge machinery they have nowadays maneuvering around the hedge-rows was too annoying.

At the same time though, some were removed for future housing areas and these are not small houses.
It is not a Christian attitude but it would not bother me one bit if when the dry weather hits they have to shovel dirt off of their drive ways and side walks.
These are they type of housing areas where all trees are removed , those trees make it so much harder to build the plywood - OSB clap trap things they build nowadays and there is nothing to stop the soil blowing off of the field from burying their yards,
Last edited by RpR Dec 4, 2018 1:00 AM Icon for preview
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Dec 4, 2018 7:09 AM CST
Name: Kristi
east Texas pineywoods (Zone 8a)
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I am always amazed when I revisit the farming area I am still rooted to. Farming has changed and not for the better.

But some things are similar in this area. We have "pasture improvement" so fence rows are sprayed and mowed and there is no longer habitat for wildlife. Plants that were common to this area are gone as is some wildlife. From years of cotton farming, the soil is depleted as well. The price will be paid for generations to come.

Thank you for allowing me to join in as my heart is still in the MidWest. Lovey dubby (Except in wintertime!) Whistling
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Dec 4, 2018 7:11 AM CST
Name: Ginny G
Central Iowa (Zone 5a)
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Kristi I think you should at least visit in winter to refresh your memory Angel Hilarious! Hilarious!
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Dec 4, 2018 7:22 AM CST
Name: Kristi
east Texas pineywoods (Zone 8a)
Herbs Region: Texas Vegetable Grower Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 2
Legalily said:Kristi I think you should at least visit in winter to refresh your memory Angel Hilarious! Hilarious!


OH, but I do... I still have family there and it would seem the worst of winter is the best time to die. Big Grin In the past when my brother called to tell me someone had passed, I said "WHAT is wrong with you people, dieing in winter!?!!" He laughed and said "odds are, the next one won't be here" Thanks alot! Hilarious!
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Dec 4, 2018 7:26 AM CST
Name: Ginny G
Central Iowa (Zone 5a)
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Rolling on the floor laughing Rolling on the floor laughing Rolling on the floor laughing
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Dec 4, 2018 10:00 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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Can I visit Texas during the summer and ask What is wrong with you people?
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Dec 4, 2018 10:09 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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I had to Google pineywoods TX. I did not know they have trees in Texas.
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Dec 4, 2018 10:47 AM CST
Name: Kristi
east Texas pineywoods (Zone 8a)
Herbs Region: Texas Vegetable Grower Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 2
I'm almost as far east as you can get without being in Louisiana.

I did not know they have trees in Texas.
Sshhhh Don't tell anyone. This area is very much like northern Minnesota. The soil is red, hilly with pine trees except winters are moderate and we have no natural lakes. Reservoirs and ponds are all manmade.

Can I visit Texas during the summer and ask What is wrong with you people?


Most people would... nodding but in MN, the summers are equally hot and humid. They just don't last as long and not everything there is air conditioned as it is in the south.

With all you Sans, you might love it!
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Dec 4, 2018 10:55 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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Last couple of times we drove across various parts of Texas we would stop when we saw a house/ranch for sale. Grabbed a copy of the brochure. Checking out prices can be interesting. As well as what they mention. One thing we always laughed at was the phrase: Scattered trees. We had to look hard but soon discovered it meant there were 3 or 4 tall bushes somewhere. A big sales point?
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Dec 4, 2018 11:02 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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All of our trips through Texas were to collect rocks. Started out in the NE. Then East. Boy, there were entire counties were they were farming and the ground was about 99.3% solid rocks, .7% soil. I too some pix of some pix of road cuts but cannot find them now. Stopped to talk to one farmer and I asked about how long his plows lasted. Gave me a funny look and walked away.
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Dec 4, 2018 11:02 AM CST
Name: Kristi
east Texas pineywoods (Zone 8a)
Herbs Region: Texas Vegetable Grower Avid Green Pages Reviewer Garden Ideas: Level 2
Yes, a snow break. LOL I remember on our MN farm here was a grove on the north and west side of our home to break the snow.

I am so deep in the woods here I worry about trees coming down on buildings or vehicles when we see hurricane blows or other storms.
Believe in yourself even when no one else will. ~ Sasquatch
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Dec 4, 2018 11:11 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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ND is probably the worst when it comes to wind and wind breaks and trees. You can tell where the ranch houses are by looking , in the distance, for small clumps of trees. There is a lot of research there on what trees might work. Most do not last long. We where there collecting petrified wood. We could spend the day parked in the middle of the road and roaming the countryside. No one ever came along. Once though a rancher did appear on his ATV. Asked us what we were doing. Mentioned that it might have been nice if we had stopped at his house first and asked permission. I looked around. You could easily see about 14 miles in any direction. No telephone poles, no buildings. I asked how we were supposed to discover his house. He laughed. (Whew.) Told us how great the land was. How it was some of the best soil in the whole country for raising grass. But, they got less than 10" of rain a year. I asked how big his ranch was. He laughed and said his was just a small place, way below average. Only 5800 acres.
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Dec 4, 2018 11:23 AM CST
Name: Rj
Just S of the twin cities of M (Zone 4b)
Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 1
You know you are from the MidWest and a temp in the mid 20s require a light jacket.
As Yogi Berra said, “It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”
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Dec 4, 2018 11:28 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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And the first Spring day when it hits 50 there are people in short sleeve shirts.
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Dec 4, 2018 11:32 AM CST
(Zone 5b)
When the first heavy snowfall that sticks, clears so you can finish putting the garden/yard to bed! Rolling on the floor laughing
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Dec 4, 2018 11:34 AM CST
Name: Gene Staver
Portage WI 53901 (Zone 5a)
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Dec 4, 2018 12:05 PM CST
Name: Dr. Demento Jr.
Minnesota (Zone 3b)
Legalily said:Kristi I think you should at least visit in winter to refresh your memory Angel Hilarious! Hilarious!

Ten below zero, a new six inches of fresh fluffy snow and a bright full moon night with no wind.
Heaven on Earth, I miss those days and they are now rare again.

At the same time, due to having worked in it, sub-zero, brisk wind gusts whipping snow on and off from drifts under a cold blue high pressure sodium light , snow crunching under foot, your breath when the wind dies rising like column of steam, , the silence, the image of snow swirling when a gust hits ,strikes a bit of longing in my heart.
Often you are out in it alone yet it brings back memory of some of the best times in my life ,

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