I don't think semp seeds need cold treatment Terri. : )

My seed went from packet directly to soil and germinated in a couple days with no cold treatment on my part. - Arlan

I tend to think trying to do this in Seattle this May counts as a cold treatment!
This thread has been great, I had bought the seed, my mom brought me the milk jugs for "late winter sowing" which were promptly destroyed by the dog, so I ended up with nursery trays and plastic tops. Nothing to take photos of yet, except me pouring the rain off the lid.
I had no idea 300 seeds could be so small and hard to plant! I love the amazon link, that might be next years plan.

It rained here today also Sherri. I try to look at the bright side, but I can't find the sun.

I took a couple pics this morning. Not sure if we can see a whole lot of change in the "Mixed" seedlings, just a bit bigger I guess. The S. arachnoideum seedlings are starting to show their cobwebs! - Arlan

Mixed---S. arachnoideum

They're so adorable! Amazing that they're getting webs already at this young age.

That really is amazing to see the beginning stages of webbing. Great photos Arlan. How do you get such great close ups? What kind of lens are you using?

I know they don't need cold treatment. But I wondered if cold treatment might be needed for some species mixes. I guess I should put a small amount in the freezer for a bit and compare germination in the two samples. If I had the energy.

Come on Terri, what is one little trip to the freezer?

Terri, I would agree that there may be species that do have that requirement, or that may benefit with higher germination rates from it. For all I know, I may have ungerminated seed in my "Mixed" tray as well.... I know that twitch made this point earlier also, when I asked about cold treatment requirements. A type of winter sowing may be the ticket to maximize germination of these mixed lots......for next year! - Arlan

Wasn't it twit that said to leave the tray undisturbed after removing the germinated plants. Some where along the line you may have more germinate, could be even up to a year.

Lynn, I just realized that I didn't answer your photography question....!

I use a Cannon PowerShot Pro that I bought in 2005. It is what I would call an upper end point and shoot camera. Its lens is a zoom lens which I use to its fullest in combination with a "super macro" setting, which allows for a very close focus, even at max zoom. I have learned to work with a major short coming with the system, and that is its viewfinder. It has "through the lens" viewing, but is digital and not optical, so I cannot see fine enough detail to manually focus. This forces me to use the auto focus, which can be a pain.... I close the lens down as far as I can....which is only f8, (I’d die for f16!) to maximize depth of field....but then I must use flash to get the exposure short enough to get sharp images... as I hand hold everything and often shoot moving targets! Now, I only have the built in pop-up flash so....when I have the lens zoomed all the way out, it casts a shadow on the subject from the flash, limiting how close I can get to a subject. I have worked around this as well by using a hand held diffuser/reflector ( ….that thin,approx. 1/8" thick smooth bubble wrap!) to create enough indirect light to get a decent picture. These close-up pictures, taken this way have a nice feel to them as the diffused light casts no shadows ! The last two pictures I posted here were taken this way.

It has taken me a couple years to figure this all out, but I never claimed to be a speedy learner! It may sound complicated, but it is all just second nature to me now. This little camera just “fits me like a glove”! I would love to get a nice SLR outfit with proper macro lenses and lighting equipment etc…but then I can just imagine I’d lose some of my mobility and spontaneity until I learned that system. I just use my camera now to document what’s going on in the yard and to give me that closer look. I can’t tell you how much I have discovered and learned by taking in focus close-ups and then looking at them at 100%! It has been my “microscope” …. - Arlan

Yes Lynn, that is what twitch suggested. The challenge becomes keeping the tray moist enough through the heat of the summer with out causing the seed to rot. I'm thinking that a type of winter sowing would give proper treatment for all, and minimize the above challenges down here in the south. ...or, I could just raise those plants that don't need the cold treatment! I guess one would develop strains of parent plants that don't require it after a few generations..... - Arlan

I have no excuse except being afraid of trying to learn how to use my camera. There is so much I will do if I just take the time like you have done.
I just need to take time to play with the different setting, I even have a great book to go with it.

You always post great photos, Lynn! Like most things in life, one figures out the things that are important to them, one at a time! - Arlan

I was so taken with your Carolina Wren photos, I have not been able to do something like that yet. I still go back and look at them. : )

Your seedlings look great Arlen.

You won't see much difference between them until they start to colour up in the late summer - even now, almost a year later, I'm still amazed at the differences in mine.

I have some that produce chicks really early, others that still have none. some are pointy leaved, some tightly clustered, some wooly, some smooth.

All are amazing, and I can't bear to give any up until I have some chicks off them.

They are the coolest plants.

I've saved seed now for a whole new mix of small types, and larger types. They could still be all mixed of both kinds, as they are insect pollinated as you know. It will be so interesting to see how those look a year from now.

You'll see why the advice to sow thinly once you try to prick them out to repot them. The problem I've had is that if they're really crowded, they stall and won't grow, so you may have to line them out in a clean flat, and separate them a bit. It's very fiddly work, it leaves me with the jitters! It's worth it in the end when they start showing their adult colours and shapes.

Thanks for visiting the thread, Jacki!

I'm really looking forward to seeing the differences between these plants. This is the part of gardening that I really enjoy. Not having raised them before....I really don't know what to expect.

I will need to do some "pricking out" of these to give them room, like you say. I'll probably tackle that in a couple weeks. What kind of spacing would you recommend? - Arlan

The spacing you go for totally depends on how much room you have to allot to this hobby/addiction, and how much time you have on your hands!

If I'm just re-planting them into for example, two-three flats for each flat of seedlings, I'll try and space them about 1-2" apart in each direction. By the time they fill this space, by the fall, you'll be able to see which ones are most appealing and re-pot those into separate pots, or even into a nursery bed outside.

I found they did perfectly well here for me this past winter, outside, no particular care, under 18" of snow. The ones that did the best were in 2" pots, with Sunshine Mix #4. The ones that did the worst were in 4" pots, same mix. Still puzzling over that. I think they got too wet as the polymer in the mix breaks down. You won't have the same issue, as you live in a much warmer climate. Don't be too kind to them, though, they don't appreciate it, and they will die. Be tough, and callous to them. Make sure that whatever mix you use is perfectly draining, whether in the nursery bed right in ground, or in pots. Very crucial!

Thanks, that gives some great insight, not only to expected growth the first year, but also reinforces everything we read about perfect drainage as key. I think I'll use flats and space about 1 1/2", tweaked for what works for the dimensions of the flats. I love the look of equally spaced plants in a flat.....a little warped, I know! Its the small things in life......... - Arlan