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Jul 28, 2023 9:38 AM CST
Name: Rj
Just S of the twin cities of M (Zone 4b)
Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 1
UrbanWild said: The Xerces Society puts out a free milkweed guide available for download. Below is a segment screen shot but the entire guide is very informative...

Thumb of 2023-07-27/UrbanWild/5a1357

Excellent info, thanks!

https://xerces.org/sites/defau...
As Yogi Berra said, “It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”
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Jul 28, 2023 9:46 AM CST
Name: Rj
Just S of the twin cities of M (Zone 4b)
Forum moderator Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 1
Swamp Milkweed (Asclepias incarnata) seed pods.
Thumb of 2023-07-28/crawgarden/9638d9
As Yogi Berra said, “It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”
Last edited by crawgarden Jul 28, 2023 9:47 AM Icon for preview
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Jul 28, 2023 1:14 PM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
Almost no butterflies this year so far. And the few I saw, were singles. No egg laying.
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Jul 28, 2023 8:32 PM CST
Name: UrbanWild
Kentucky (Zone 6b)
Kentucky - Plant Hardiness Zone 7a
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Birds Vegetable Grower Spiders! Organic Gardener Native Plants and Wildflowers
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purpleinopp said: If anybody wants to sweat and get mosquito bites for their effort, they're welcome to "control" the aphids on my milkweed. Trying to control nature seems like an arrogant concept to me, as if humans can do that at all. If I could control nature, all of my plants would be perfect and there would be no pests in the first place. But nature is not perfect, and includes aphids and ants and mosquitoes.


I don't think anyone suggested controlling all of nature. But humans build houses, roads, floodwalls, use pesticides, build sewers, etc. etc ad nauseum all in an effort to control aspects of the natural world. They're all results from the manifestation of a host of challenges we have to deal with.

I'll use my specific case as an example. I grow milkweeds for a few reasons:

1) To aid monarch populations
2) they're natives
3) they're pretty and common even smells nice
4) pollinators LOVE them
5) I collect a LOT of seeds. I give away about half and then send the rest to various conversation efforts

Of all the reasons that I grow them, #1 is by far the most important.

So if I want to help monarchs, I need to maximize the efforts on my small property. I do so with strategic plantings, and beating back threats to milkweed production, larval success, and seed production. They didn't get into population decline by accident. Most of it is thanks to the most invasive and destructive species on the planet... Us. I'm doing everything in my power to create successful outcomes for the plants as well as the monarchs. The very real threats to the plants include milkweed bugs, milkweed beetles, oleander aphids (Mediterranean in origin and thought now to be cosmopolitan largely due to gardening), paper wasps, etc. A byproduct of the aphis is black sooty mold. Sooty mold reduces plant vigor and may even kill it. It also makes milkweed nearly useless to larvae. So... Aphids reduction or elimination means less issues for the milkweed and ultimately the monarch caterpillars.

I kill milkweed bugs for two reasons, they kill milkweed plants and most especially, they kill seed production. I don't use checks anywhere on the property. They get killed manually or with a quick spritz of alcohol followed by a water wash off. I may be able to does the populations hyperlocally, but both the native and nonnative threats to milkweed have much more robust populations than the monarchs.

Last year we had a banner year for Asian paper wasps. That continues to this very day. I've been netting and killing them to lessen monarch caterpillar predation. Again, this is to achieve the goal of maximizing for monarchs and milkweed... Not an attempt to control nature but to reset the equilibrium that had been disrupted. I hope that makes more sense of my position.
Always looking for interesting plants for pollinators and food! Bonus points for highly, and pleasantly scented plants.

"Si hortum in bibliotheca habes, nihil deerit." [“If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need.”] -- Marcus Tullius Cicero in Ad Familiares IX, 4, to Varro. 46 BCE
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Jul 29, 2023 7:58 AM CST
Name: Tiffany purpleinopp
Opp, AL @--`--,----- 🌹 (Zone 8b)
Region: United States of America Houseplants Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Garden Sages Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 2
Organic Gardener Composter Miniature Gardening Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Tender Perennials Butterflies
It is not necessary for me to understand or share your position for it to be a valid position. I understand it, but don't share it. Wouldn't know a paper wasp if it was biting my arm, as is my knowledge about 99% of what is going on outside. So I don't feel qualified to decide which of them should or should not be there, or mess around with creatures who have a home because I have moved some plants to my yard. And I don't want to, as far as deciding how to spend my time. I expect those creatures to stay outside in their home and not come into and alter my home. I feel like I can best honor nature by leaving it alone, except for maintaining as many plants as possible (vs. just more mowed area), providing a couple sources of water, and the enjoyment of observing the antics of nature when I can.

I respect your position and appreciate the privilege of having it shared with me and the other members. Thank you for the interesting conversation. It's nothing personal, or any reflection on your excellent explanation, that I don't choose to adopt it as my own. I get stuck wondering if native theory is valid, or if things are evolving. Or something else that people don't yet understand. Maybe the plants are actually in charge and their success is convincing humans to move them around and cultivate them.

It makes me sad when people say that humans are not part of nature. Humans can be positive participants, or otherwise, but that doesn't tell me that the entire species is a negative force. I don't feel that way about myself.
The golden rule: Do to others only that which you would have done to you.
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Jul 29, 2023 9:10 AM CST
Name: UrbanWild
Kentucky (Zone 6b)
Kentucky - Plant Hardiness Zone 7a
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Understood and agreed. Just wanted to provide some backstory so that you knew it wasn't just an exercise in manipulation but there were reasons behind the actions. Thanks for the reply.
Always looking for interesting plants for pollinators and food! Bonus points for highly, and pleasantly scented plants.

"Si hortum in bibliotheca habes, nihil deerit." [“If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need.”] -- Marcus Tullius Cicero in Ad Familiares IX, 4, to Varro. 46 BCE
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Jul 29, 2023 12:54 PM CST
Name: Tiffany purpleinopp
Opp, AL @--`--,----- 🌹 (Zone 8b)
Region: United States of America Houseplants Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Garden Sages Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 2
Organic Gardener Composter Miniature Gardening Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Tender Perennials Butterflies
: ) Anytime. I think these things are interesting to discuss. And if everybody was doing the same thing, there would be nothing to discuss.
The golden rule: Do to others only that which you would have done to you.
👀😁😂 - SMILE! -☺😎☻☮👌✌∞☯
The only way to succeed is to try!
🐣🐦🐔🍯🐾🌺🌻🌸🌼🌹
The best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago. The 2nd best time is now. (-Unknown)
👒🎄👣🏡🍃🍂🌾🌿🍁❦❧🍁🍂🌽❀☀ ☕👓🐝
Try to be more valuable than a bad example.
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Jul 30, 2023 4:17 PM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
The swamp milkweed are making a comeback in containers. Yesterday, I had another monarch in the yard unless the same one came back. But no mate for it. Same for the Tiger Swallowtail hanging around today. Just one.

Thumb of 2023-07-30/LorettaNJ/66e684
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Aug 1, 2023 7:31 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
Been growing milkweed for three years with no Monarchs. Finally saw one fluttering around, and now some eggs!

Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
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Aug 1, 2023 1:02 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Ronnie (Veronica)
Southeastern PA (Zone 6b)
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Good news Christie Hurray!
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Aug 1, 2023 2:13 PM CST
Name: Nancy
Northeastern Illinois (Zone 5b)
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I only need to see one Monarch butterfly or caterpillar on a milkweed to make it worthwhile for me, so congrats!
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Aug 1, 2023 5:41 PM CST
Name: Tiffany purpleinopp
Opp, AL @--`--,----- 🌹 (Zone 8b)
Region: United States of America Houseplants Overwinters Tender Plants Indoors Garden Sages Plant Identifier Garden Ideas: Level 2
Organic Gardener Composter Miniature Gardening Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Tender Perennials Butterflies
I haven't seen any monarchs but other butterflies love the trop. milkweed, and hummers don't seem as interested but do visit the blooms occasionally. I've seen several kinds of swallowtails &/or zebras and skippers going from bloom to bloom, plant to plant.
The golden rule: Do to others only that which you would have done to you.
👀😁😂 - SMILE! -☺😎☻☮👌✌∞☯
The only way to succeed is to try!
🐣🐦🐔🍯🐾🌺🌻🌸🌼🌹
The best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago. The 2nd best time is now. (-Unknown)
👒🎄👣🏡🍃🍂🌾🌿🍁❦❧🍁🍂🌽❀☀ ☕👓🐝
Try to be more valuable than a bad example.
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Aug 2, 2023 7:45 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
I would like to qualify as a Monarch station, but I still need to plant one more type of milkweed. It looks like the following are good/native for Ohio, and would also fit in the space I have. I am wondering if anyone has seeds to share for:
~~ Whorled milkweed (Asclepias verticillata)
~~ White milkweed (Asclepias variegata)
Crossing Fingers! I could pay for postage if needed.
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
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Aug 2, 2023 8:05 AM CST
Name: UrbanWild
Kentucky (Zone 6b)
Kentucky - Plant Hardiness Zone 7a
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Birds Vegetable Grower Spiders! Organic Gardener Native Plants and Wildflowers
Hummingbirder Frogs and Toads Dog Lover Critters Allowed Butterflies Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge)
Howdy " neighbor"! The three most widely available and easiest to maintain in this area would be common, swamp, and butterfly weed.
Always looking for interesting plants for pollinators and food! Bonus points for highly, and pleasantly scented plants.

"Si hortum in bibliotheca habes, nihil deerit." [“If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need.”] -- Marcus Tullius Cicero in Ad Familiares IX, 4, to Varro. 46 BCE
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Aug 2, 2023 8:26 AM CST
Thread OP
Name: Ronnie (Veronica)
Southeastern PA (Zone 6b)
Count your blessings, be grateful
Region: Ukraine Organic Gardener Keeps Goats Zinnias Dog Lover Morning Glories
Annuals Bee Lover Dragonflies Butterflies Hummingbirder Birds
@cwhitt Christie, I have whorled milkweed seeds if you want some. Send me a message with your address.
Kindness is the language which the deaf can hear and the blind can see.
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Aug 2, 2023 9:24 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
@luvsgrtdanes - THANKS! Thank You! Just sent you my address with a list of a few seeds that I have to share if you're interested. Thank You! Thank You! Thank You!
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
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Aug 2, 2023 9:37 AM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
You might have better luck locating A. variegata seeds at the Grow Milkweed Plants FB group. There are two people who sell them sometimes both on Ebay and Etsy. One is McDermott and the other is 2hobbyfarmers. I bought roots from one of them and they came true.

As for A verticillata, it is a thin leaf and doesn't go too far feeding monarchs. However, It is a nice plant to grow. So far, my plant has run underground and comes up sparsely here and there. I don't have the thick growth yet I see in searches.
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Aug 2, 2023 9:49 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
UrbanWild said: Howdy " neighbor"! The three most widely available and easiest to maintain in this area would be common, swamp, and butterfly weed.

How tall does that butterfly weed get? I have seen anywhere from 2' to about 5'. 5' might be too tall for me.
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.
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Aug 2, 2023 10:31 AM CST
Northern NJ (Zone 7a)
Butterflyweed (A. tuberosa) is about 2' more or less for me. It is the smallest of the three mentioned. I haven't seen it get 5'. A search has it as high as 3'.
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Aug 2, 2023 11:14 AM CST
Name: Christie
Central Ohio 43016 (Zone 6a)
Plays on the water.
Amaryllis Permaculture Sempervivums Roses Bookworm Annuals
Composter Hybridizer Cat Lover Garden Ideas: Master Level
LorettaNJ said: Butterflyweed (A. tuberosa) is about 2' more or less for me. It is the smallest of the three mentioned. I haven't seen it get 5'. A search has it as high as 3'.

Is it easy to grow by seed, or do I need to buy a plant?
Plant Dreams. Pull Weeds. Grow A Happy Life.

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