Michael,

Looks as though it's producing extra stigmas on at least some of the flowers. Fastigate plants will sometimes do that too but I've never seen it on a normal rosette.

Kevin

There were three stalks on that NOID semp and I only found these odd seed heads on two of them. If they weren't monocarpic I'd check again next year on the same rosettes...

Michael those are crazy seed heads. Wonder what the offspring will look like.
I am not looking forward to the next 3 days. We are under an "extreme heat warning" til 10 pm on Wed. Tues is supposed to be over 100. It was over 100 today. I already have semps that are still putting up wierd little flowers on short stems and Nico just keeps pumping out the offsets. Cant wait to see what 5 days of extreme heat does to them. I really don't think these stunted flowers would be good for seed.
I am curious if anyone else is having this experience and what are your thoughts on it?

100° expected here today.
I have had some of the stunted bloom stalks, but also plenty of big robust bloom stalks. I am wondering if it has to do with certain types?

Ok ... one step beyond where I got to last year. The seed that is dry enough has been bagged. There is still more but it still has blossoms hanging on the ends of the stems. Actually a couple of stems had some capsules that are open. Lost a bit but there are a lot of stems. All of Polly Bishop went to seed sure was not aiming for that. Lost Diavolo and Cafe to seed also but got the seed. I sure hope it rains soon. Supposed to happen Sat. We'll see. Can't see across the road for smoke. The ash from the Gorge is going all way to Gearhart/Astoria.

JoAnn,

Remember, Store them upside down in paper sandwich bags. When picking the stalks, do it CAREFULLY as you will shed seed everywhere. I use fine clippers and support the stalk so it doesn't wiggle much.

Leave them for ~ 30-45 days in a dry space (mine are in the garage) and then crush the stalk while in the bag to get the last seeds out of the capsules. Then decant the seed and chaff mixture and store it in glassine envelopes at 4C in the crisper of your refrigerator (I put all the glassine envelopes in coin envelopes and the collection of coin envelopes in a Ziplock bag).

This year EVERYTHING set seed like mad. Wet spring followed by dry hot summer.

Kevin

Thanks Kevin, I did exactly what you said in the first paragraph. Now let's see if I can get through the second. I was wondering about cleaning the seed. Normal winnowing would blow away the seed and you would be left with the chaff. I had just about decided to plant both and pick out the big chaff. I only had one seed stalk dump some out on my arm..

JoAnn,

Some of the stalks that go very dry will shed their seed into the bottom of the bag and have very little chaff. If you let the seed stalks dry in the bags until October, most of the seed capsules will have fallen out of the capsules. Others require more of a squeeze to release their seed. I give the bag a gentle crush and then decant the bag over a sheet of white paper that is lying flat but has a fold in the middle. You can hand pick out the bigger pieces of chaff at that point. I then fold the paper and decant the seeds and small bits of chaff into ungummed glassine envelopes. Fold these envelopes and place that envelope in a coin envelope that i seal. Semp seed is so fine that it can leak out unless you do the double envelope technique. I then put the envelopes in a Ziplock bag and store them in the crisper until late February. They are then planted in pots in a good potting mix.

Ed Skrocki used a series of sieves to get the seed very clean but neither Bill Nixon or I found that the chaff significantly affected germination.

Kevin

Thanks Kevin
I was thinking that the small chaff might not be much of a problem.
I collected some Heuff seed heads this afternoon and found the there were some open seed capsules at the bottom of the stem while there was still a bloom at the end of the stem. I cut off the bloom and the top capsule if it was not dry enough. I don't want mold. Some of them were dropping seed right into the bag as I put them in.
I also have 2 semp stems that are fastigated. I kept them seperate from all others. I wonder if they are worth keeping and growing this seed or not. I am not much of a fan of crested semps. hmmm any advice from someone more experienced?

Jo Ann,

Things like Denise's Cobweb that produce crests regularly will give some seedlings that crest too. The seed from a crested rosette seem not to be any more prone to producing crests than does the parent. I planted a bunch on a magnificent crested Dark Cloud and not one was crested.

Hope that helps!

Kevin

Yes Kevin that helps. I may just plant the seed from the crested stems and see what comes of it.
It turns out that I do seem to have one plant of the correct Apache and it had a lovely seed stalk that dropped a ton of seed right into the bottom of the bag when I put it in there.It was surrounded by other dark Heuffs. I got lots of seed from all of them but they are bee crosses so the seedlings could be quite a mix up. Greenstone and Gold bug are not ripe yet. Actually they still have flowers which those little bumble bees just can't resist.
I have so much seed I truly do not know where I can plant it all. I have a feeling things will be crowded Perhaps that situation will encourage me to keep only those that show some color early. If they have really good saturated color do they show it earlier? I did chose some for green. glad I kept them labeled.

The first full year from seed these were plain green.

Lynn are you saying that we need to keep all our seedlings till the second year as they do not color the first year? Those are wonderful colors. are they all sibs? they all have very wide fat leaves. I like the little goldie guy in the back..but the red is a shocker. wow. Nice work Lynn.

They are all siblings. They are from 'Persephone' crossed with 'Michael's Golden and 'Othello', plus bees at work.
That first year from seed may not show to much, sometimes there might be a standout with promise that first year. I can see why it take 3 years to really see what a seedling is going to do.
And then there are the ones that are not thrifty growers, those can go away after the first year.

Lynn those look great!!

Thank you Greg. They sure know how to morph in colors.

By "thrifty grower" do you mean that the ones that grow fast get kept and the thrifty=slow week ones are removed?

I tend to go through my seedlings on a more or less regular base. When I find something of interest I mark its label with red tape on the backside and turn around the tag to make the red marker clearly visible. As my seedlings are currently super crowded I usually do a transplant right after selection.

My usual criteria are colour and/or shape/surface structure. Size comes later. If there are several seedlings with similar shape/ colouring I obviously prefer the bigger/ healthier looking ones. Some seedlings are super slow growers in the first year. But make a growth spurt in the second.
That's why I prefer to go for size in the second place and look more for interesting traits in its appearance.

My only yellow seedling is a terribly slow grower, but still a keeper. Let's see what next year brings.
My only variegated seedling was a terribly slow grower in the first year and increased its diameter by more than 5times in the second year and grew into a beautiful rosette with 3 offsets, but completely lost its variegated colouring.
Another one I transplanted like 4 weeks ago was yellowish with a bright pink centre (that's why it got selected), now it has turned into an ugly dark greenish-brown.
You never know what you get...

Michael,

So true! I try not to get too excited until I've seen the performance for a second year after selection. By then, the plant seems to be fairly stable and consistent.

Borscht came up as a dark purple seedling even in its cotyledon leaves. ~5% of the Borscht seedlings do the early coloring thing too.

Kevin

I agree with both Kevin and Michael, it's not really the size when I say "thrifty grower". Some of the seedlings are obviously weak, the cold rainy season damages them, and they drought season in the summer causes more damage. I look for the ones that show no damage during those two difficult seasons.