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Feb 6, 2020 10:47 PM CST
Name: Sol Zimmerdahl
Portland, Oregon (Zone 8b)
Container Gardener Garden Art Sempervivums
Lynn,
I don't know how much weight I'll put on blooms, especially because you have to wait clear till the end of all the plants life cycles to make the appropriate selection, but I do have a Clairchin x self batch of seed. If I get some seedlings I may try for the biggest, roundest blooms I can get, using only this group to select from. It really is something to see a voluptuous bloom on any succulent, especially a sempervivum, if I can get a better size than the parent plant the offspring might be able to compete with Lewisia's!
Another bloom I was enamored with was 'Pacific Magic Knight', also a really big flower, the pistils are particularly wide, large and are also pink, adding to the appeal. 'PMK' also has short bloom stalks, with a big bloom it's an interesting contrast.
With respect to crossing Sempervivum ciliosum fr/ Ali Botusch, I think using it to add fur to a particularly large cultivar would be worthwhile especially because it sounds like it's the biggest Ciliosum. Another idea would be to cross it with a plant that has a lot of color, furry plants with good color are hard to come by. In my crosses with borisii this year I crossed with reds, velvets and firballs. I'm trying hard to get a distinctive fur pattern not already out there, and seeing as Ciliosum's are rarely hybridized I thought it would make a good candidate to accomplish that goal. In addition to the above I'd like to mention that it contributes its round shape and dense leaf build to it's offspring, so it might be a miracle cure for bad spindly form. Just a few thoughts Rolling my eyes.

Kevin,
The 'Frosch Konig' bloom does sound pretty. I wonder what it's parents are.
This winter may not be as cold as the last but I think it's been much wetter. Voles and Moles sound like a big threat to young seedlings, I'm thankful not to have any here. However something has been eating my seedlings at a frustrating rate, I think it's slugs but its hard to imagine a slug eating a semp clear down to it's base. I used pesticides on the part of the garden that was getting hit the worst and chomp marks started showing up in other places of the garden, I may have to spray the whole thing! So far none of the effected plants have died, but as you can imagine little semp stumps don't look very attractive and won't be judgable any time soon.
-Sol
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Feb 6, 2020 10:52 PM CST
Name: Sol Zimmerdahl
Portland, Oregon (Zone 8b)
Container Gardener Garden Art Sempervivums
I look forward to seeing both of your 'Aymon Correvon' seedlings, we could use more velvet greys!
Hopefully I get some cool ones out of Thunder.
-Sol
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Feb 7, 2020 9:47 AM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
Kevin what year are the 'Aymon Correvon' seedling from? I need to come over and see how all the babies are doing.

Sol, the slugs are legion this year. I have been broadcasting slug bait, the one safe around pets and children, also bird safe. They will take a young tender plant down to the ground.
Last edited by valleylynn Feb 7, 2020 9:54 AM Icon for preview
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Feb 7, 2020 12:56 PM CST
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
The seedlings will be one year olds in spring so they're not big yet. There are some velvety ones in the group. Am a bit more excited by the 'Pacific Joyce' seedlings as PJ is much more fertile than 'Aymon Correvon'.

I've already slug-baited around the Iris unguicularis as the slugs love having blooms to chew on. I'm going to treat the rest of the yard on Sunday, which is supposed to be a DRY DAY.

Kevin
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Feb 7, 2020 1:30 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
Thumbs up
Kevin, have you used 'Le Clair's Hybrid #1' as a parent?
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Feb 7, 2020 5:32 PM CST
Name: Sol Zimmerdahl
Portland, Oregon (Zone 8b)
Container Gardener Garden Art Sempervivums
Lynn,
I'm really wanting to use 'Le Clair's Hybrid #1', I got a plant from you a couple years back and it's made a nice little colony but hasn't grown all that much. Just upgraded its pot, still I doubt I'll get a bloom this year.
Hoping also to try 'Soft Line'.
It will be interesting to see if 'Pacific Magic Knight' produces anything, I like that one a lot, but not a lot of flowers on the stalk I got.
-Sol
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Feb 8, 2020 12:35 AM CST
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Lynn,

No don't own or even remember seeing La Clair's Hybrid. It looks cool though.

Kevin
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Feb 8, 2020 9:56 AM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
It is one of the very velvety ones that I have had since 2013. Nothing seems to bother it. Not drought or our wet season.
Avatar for JungleShadows
Feb 8, 2020 10:25 AM CST
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Sol,

I did self pollinate 'Pacific Magic Knight' and got no seedlings. Of course it could be my being a bad bee. It does have larger flowers, which may mean that it is a tetraploid or something from grandiflorum, although the flower form does not look like a grandiflorum. To ,me it looks like a bigger version of the typical tectorum X montanum cross.

Kevin
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Feb 8, 2020 1:21 PM CST
Name: Sol Zimmerdahl
Portland, Oregon (Zone 8b)
Container Gardener Garden Art Sempervivums
Kevin,
Yes I've thought it was a Montanum cross as well, knowing how crucial 'Hausmanii' was in Gary's velvet lines it almost certainly is a Montanum derivative. The flowers didn't have long petals like I've come to expect from Grandiflorum, but it's hard to be sure. I figured it had some Tectorum and possibly Wulfenii because of the color (which I absolutely love). We'll see what I get, if you didn't get anything from it I wouldn't be surprised if I don't, those velvets just seem to be duds so often. Gary used massive numbers of bloomstalks pollinated by bee's, so he was able to coax some pretty interesting things out of plants with low fertility.
I crossed 'PMK' with 'Pip' and itself.
We'll see, I'm planting my seed now.
-Sol
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Feb 8, 2020 4:26 PM CST
Name: Kevin Vaughn
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Sol,

I just took a break after getting about 100 bags of seed cleaned and readied to be planted after a little refrigerator nap. One of these cleaning projects included 'Aymon Correvon' ad this year the seed was PLENTIFUL. Now it all may be DUD seed but I have never seen anything like this. I did let 5 stalks open pollinate and in general a good year for seed set here in Oregon. So many dry days that were good for pollen formation.

Anyway I guess the moral of the story is never give up on these velvet ones for seed set. When I was a kid, 'Cleveland Morgan' was a very fertile velvet and gave a majority of velvet seedlings. Skrocki's 'Ohio Burgundy' was no doubt a seedling of it too and it might be another we should be using in breeding for velvets.

The purple velvet from open pollinated 'Greenwich Time' seems to have made lots of good seed from selfing it too. Am hoping that I still have some calcareum genes in there too as that would be fun to explore. It might be nearly a pure montanum though, considering how fertile it is.

Kevin
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Feb 8, 2020 7:17 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
Never ending possibilities Kevin. That is so exciting.
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Feb 9, 2020 7:17 AM CST
Name: Sol Zimmerdahl
Portland, Oregon (Zone 8b)
Container Gardener Garden Art Sempervivums
'Kevin,
'Ohio Burgundy' is a good one that I have considered buying many times because of its velvet and seasonally striking colors, I bet it would make a good parent. I will have my own crop of 'Cleveland Morgan' crosses this year, spread it's pollen far and wide. I should get a selection to suit my needs from these, but if I don't, I've considered trying 'Chivalry', 'Dusky', and 'Ohio Burgundy' as possible starting points to a velvet Montanum based line. Planted some 'Midas' x Arachnoideum seed yesterday that looked very viable, if my Montanum attempts come up empty I bet these Grandiflorum x Arachnoideums will be a satisfying velvet consolation.
-Sol
Last edited by GeologicalForms Feb 9, 2020 1:10 PM Icon for preview
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Mar 17, 2020 3:00 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Mark McDonough
Massachusetts (Zone 5a)
Region: Massachusetts Enjoys or suffers cold winters Garden Procrastinator Native Plants and Wildflowers Garden Photography Foliage Fan
Birds Seed Starter Hybridizer Sempervivums
Both forms of Semp ciliosum (var. borisii, now called ssp. ciliosum), and ciliosum from Ali Botusch have overwintered well and starting to plump up.

What I have left of ciliosum var. borisii is this one little pot, my large old colony growing in a pot these last 15 years or so, was victim to an overturned planter. 4 hens & 6 chicks, will be watching these carefully:

Thumb of 2020-03-17/AntMan01/6303db


Semp ciliosum from Ali Botusch, one of two plants. Last year as an experiment, I dechicked one and grew on the chicks separately, thius is the 2nd plant where I left the chicks on.

Thumb of 2020-03-17/AntMan01/580590


8 chicks on Semp ciliosum from Ali Botusch survived well enough, now starting to open up. The pot on the right has Semp 'Poco Loco', with the rosettes opening up and coloring red
Thumb of 2020-03-17/AntMan01/18fd6c

Note: these photos taken morning of 03/17/2020, last several nights down to 18F - 20F, so even though temps reached low 40s by afternoon, the pots were still frozen. Last week we had temps in upper 60s and reaching low 70s!
Avatar: Jovibarba x nixonii 'Jowan'
I use #2 chicken grit to feed my hens & chicks :-)
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Mar 17, 2020 3:25 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
Wonderful to see that they came through winter in good shape Mark.
I lost my ciliosum from Ali Botusch when I put in the new beds. Not sure what happened. It was my favorite of the ciliosum. Maybe some day I will replace it.
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Mar 20, 2020 4:23 AM CST
Central CT (Zone 6b)
Bee Lover Butterflies Garden Photography Hibiscus Hummingbirder Sedums
Sempervivums Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge)
Looking good, Mark!
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Mar 22, 2020 12:39 PM CST
Name: Dirt
(Zone 5b)
Region: Utah Bee Lover Garden Photography Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Photo Contest Winner: 2015 Photo Contest Winner: 2016
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just whatever ciliosum I have
Thumb of 2020-03-22/dirtdorphins/af624d
still, so very neato
Thumb of 2020-03-22/dirtdorphins/72dd33
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Mar 22, 2020 12:49 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Lynn
Oregon City, OR (Zone 8b)
Charter ATP Member Garden Sages I helped plan and beta test the plant database. I helped beta test the Garden Planting Calendar I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator
Forum moderator I helped beta test the first seed swap Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Plant and/or Seed Trader Garden Ideas: Master Level
What a gorgeous shot of your ciliosum. What is not to love about it.
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Mar 23, 2020 11:25 AM CST
Name: Bev
Salem OR (Zone 8a)
Container Gardener Foliage Fan Sempervivums Photo Contest Winner: 2014 Garden Ideas: Master Level
I agree Hurray! Lovey dubby
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Mar 23, 2020 2:56 PM CST
Central CT (Zone 6b)
Bee Lover Butterflies Garden Photography Hibiscus Hummingbirder Sedums
Sempervivums Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge)
Great shots, Dirt! Lovey dubby

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