you know I have to admit defeat... guess there are situations that don't work with coir.. I had agastache root beer that I sowed in paper cells from dollar general... like 1" cells... ran out of perlite and just used straight coir.. guess it was a bad combo.. the seedlings are alive but not thriving in there.. germinated on 2/27 and only look a month old today.. I can say that setup was not a good one