they are available on proven winners site for pre-order for next year, I assume that mean 2023 spring. PW is known for taking old varieties of plants, giving them new names and marketing it as though it is a new thing, so who knows about them. I find that very distasteful and has a scammy feel to me. But they also have many plants that really are new varieties and are exclusive to PW so maybe that is the case here, I hope so. Both of them look gorgeous. I wonder if they are in the database here? So many plants I have bought in the past few years from PW or monrovia are not listed in our database I noticed.
https://www.provenwinners.com/...
https://www.provenwinners.com/...
