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Jan 10, 2014 6:44 PM CST
Name: Greg Hodgkinson
Hanover PA (Zone 6b)
Garden Photography Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Irises Region: Japan Region: Pennsylvania
I left alot off my list of haves because I could not remember them or could not decide if they were Plicatas.

Exactitude
Instructor
Ominous Stranger
Agressively Forward
Queen in Calico
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Jan 10, 2014 8:39 PM CST
Name: Brad
iowa (Zone 5a)
I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Wow Awesome pictures you guys !!

Tom I really like your collection there what a great group my favorite is (Exactitude) that one sure is different.

Patty here are some of my favorites in the blue/violet range I think Rumor Has It is my favorite of all of them it really is neat in a clump you should stop by Mid America in the spring and look at it. I think if I remember right Tom had some pictures of it on there Facebook page in a clump.

Rumor Has it & Petticoat Shuffle
Thumb of 2014-01-11/ARUBA1334/37b901 Thumb of 2014-01-11/ARUBA1334/a0b15c

Out Of The Dark & Wedding Night
Thumb of 2014-01-11/ARUBA1334/79f4a8 Thumb of 2014-01-11/ARUBA1334/bf2273
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Jan 10, 2014 9:56 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Patty
Washington State (Zone 8b)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Photo Contest Winner 2021
OMG I did not know what I was in for when I started this!!! how much more lawn can I take out??? So far Rumor Has It is my total gotta-have-it favorite. I LOVE it! I tromped around in the muddy fields of Mid America last May 18 so I missed the early bloomers.

And Lucy, I overlooked your post. I love Carriwitched too! I got Prince of Burgundy 2 years ago, but it didn't bloom last year and I think is now a gonner.

Tom, Ball of Confusion is really nice! And Drama Queen is on my list too.

All the pics from everyone are really beautiful!!! Lovey dubby thank you for the information and inspiration!
Patty 🌺
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Jan 10, 2014 10:21 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Patty
Washington State (Zone 8b)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Photo Contest Winner 2021
And I really love Petticoat Shuffle too!
Patty 🌺
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Jan 10, 2014 10:30 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
How about Dragon's Flight?


Or Eagle's Flight:


Gladiatrix:


Epicenter:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/8b2837

Spice Lord:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/b5b305

Amain:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/7c204d

Tennison Ridge:


Comfortable:
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 10, 2014 10:40 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 10, 2014 10:54 PM CST
Thread OP
Name: Patty
Washington State (Zone 8b)
Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Photo Contest Winner 2021
Love them all, but especially eagle's Flight and Gladiatrix, yum!
Patty 🌺
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Jan 10, 2014 10:55 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
Planned Treasure:


Vance George:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/8b494a

Queen's Circle:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/888656

Jesse's Song


Suncatcher:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/f7b789

Gypsy Lord:


Cast of Characters:


Brilliant Idea:
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 10, 2014 11:02 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
Showcase:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/0e1691

Fringe of Gold:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/79aa9a

Better picture of Showcase:
Thumb of 2014-01-11/Muddymitts/bae78e

Tequila Sunrise:


Starship Enterprise:


There's probably a few more out there -- but darned if I can remember them!! Shrug!
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 11, 2014 5:10 AM CST
Name: Tom
Southern Wisconsin (Zone 5b)
Butterflies Vegetable Grower Keeper of Poultry Irises Keeps Horses Dog Lover
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Wisconsin Celebrating Gardening: 2015
I have a hard time distinguising the Emma Cook pattern from the plicata pattern, so I have some that I didn't list as I wasn't sure which they were, but you might like some of the Emma Cooks if you like the plicatas. Kerr has developed several that are really pretty, you might want to check out his web pages.
Politicians are like diapers, they need to be changed often, and for the same reason.
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Jan 11, 2014 5:53 AM CST
Name: Vi
Ocean Springs, MS (Zone 8b)
Dog Lover Irises Lover of wildlife (Black bear badge) Region: United Kingdom Region: United States of America Region: Mississippi
Charter ATP Member Daylilies Tip Photographer I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! I sent a postcard to Randy! Garden Ideas: Level 2
Beautiful everyone of them but your Eagle's Flight really jumps out at me Mary Ann. Lovey dubby
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Jan 11, 2014 6:45 AM CST
Name: Bonnie Sojourner
Harris Brake Lake, Arkansas (Zone 7a)
Magnolia zone
Region: United States of America Region: Arkansas Master Gardener: Arkansas Irises Plant and/or Seed Trader Moon Gardener
Garden Ideas: Master Level Dragonflies Bulbs Garden Art Celebrating Gardening: 2015 Gardens in Buckets
Tom, what is Emma Cook pattern? Is that a foggy band around falls instead of stitching? Or rays coming out from the beard? I have heard this term but not often.
Thro' all the tumult and the strife I hear the music ringing; It finds an echo in my soul— How can I keep from singing?
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Jan 11, 2014 7:25 AM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 11, 2014 10:10 AM CST
Name: Tom
Southern Wisconsin (Zone 5b)
Butterflies Vegetable Grower Keeper of Poultry Irises Keeps Horses Dog Lover
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Wisconsin Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Well, I'm not really a good one to explain the differences, as I'm not sure I understand them, maybe some of the experts like @KentPfeiffer should weigh in on this one, but I know if you go into the data base and search the plant specific data for irises, and scroll down far enough you can click on Emma Cook pattern, and there will come up all of the irises that are that pattern. Here's a couple of mine that I know are Emma Cook
Ring Of Fire and Revision


I really haven't learned the distinguishing characteristics of each yet. Maybe we can both learn.
Politicians are like diapers, they need to be changed often, and for the same reason.
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Jan 11, 2014 12:13 PM CST
Name: Lucy
Tri Cities, WA (Zone 6b)
irises
Charter ATP Member Cottage Gardener Irises Region: Northeast US Region: United Kingdom Region: United States of America
Enjoys or suffers cold winters
'Emma Cook' pattern (named after an iris which had that pattern) is the one with the rim around the falls. Rim of fire & Queen's Circle are 2 of them.
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Jan 11, 2014 12:23 PM CST
Name: Mary Ann
Western Kentucky (Zone 7a)
Bee Lover Irises Hummingbirder Hostas Keeps Horses Farmer
Daylilies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Container Gardener Cat Lover Region: Kentucky Birds
But they're still plicatas, right Lucy?
Thoughts become things -- choose the good ones. (www.tut.com)
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Jan 11, 2014 12:37 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Kent Pfeiffer
Southeast Nebraska (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Plant Identifier Region: Nebraska Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Forum moderator Irises Garden Sages Garden Ideas: Master Level
Since you are a horse person, Tom, it might help to use the analogy of coat patterns in Paint Horses. To a casual observer, a horse with a tobiano coat pattern looks pretty much the same as one with an overo pattern. But, the genes that give rise to those two patterns are completely different and, I assume, an experience horseman can usually tell difference between them just by looking.

In a certain sense, irises can be split into two patterns: Plicatas and "regular" (for lack of a better word) irises. Plicatas are a recessive trait arising from a combination of genes. Ink Patterns is a classic example of the standard Plicata pattern, a light ground color with anthocyanin pigment around the edge of the petals. Usually the anthocyanin pigment has a speckled or stitched on appearance.




The Emma Cook pattern has some similarity in appearance to plicatas, light ground color with anthocyanin pigments around the edges of the petal (usually just the falls), but the genes that give rise to it are completely different. The Emma Cook pattern was developed from Amoena breeding, a "regular" iris pattern. If you look closely, the colored pigments on Emma Cook irises normally don't have that speckled appearance that is so typical of Plicatas.

The following pictures might help show the relationship between Amoenas and Emma Cooks.

Queen's Circle is a famous example of an Emma Cook



Amoenas have white standards and colored falls



Dancing Star had Queen's Circle (Emma Cook) as a pod parent and Starring (amoena) of the pollen parent. It's listed in the ATP as an Amoena, but you make the argument that it is an Emma Cook with a really broad band of color on the falls. I wonder which one Tom Johnson thinks it is, or if he even thinks about it at all?

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Jan 11, 2014 12:48 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Kent Pfeiffer
Southeast Nebraska (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Plant Identifier Region: Nebraska Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Forum moderator Irises Garden Sages Garden Ideas: Master Level
Muddymitts said:But they're still plicatas, right Lucy?


No, different genes create the Plicata pattern than those that create the Emma Cook pattern.
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Jan 11, 2014 12:57 PM CST
Moderator
Name: Kent Pfeiffer
Southeast Nebraska (Zone 5b)
Charter ATP Member I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Plant Database Moderator Plant Identifier Region: Nebraska Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Million Pollinator Garden Challenge Forum moderator Irises Garden Sages Garden Ideas: Master Level
There are other patterns related to Plicatas, though. In Luminatas, the anthocyanin pigment covers most of the petals EXCEPT the edges and the heart of the flower, essentially the reverse of a Plicata.



Glaciatas are basically Plicatas that don't have any anthocyanin pigment at all.



The almost glow in sunlight.
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Jan 11, 2014 1:30 PM CST
Name: Tom
Southern Wisconsin (Zone 5b)
Butterflies Vegetable Grower Keeper of Poultry Irises Keeps Horses Dog Lover
Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Wisconsin Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Well, I did a "small" amount of research (a little knowledge can be dangerous), anyway, I found out some things about anthocyanin pigment. A part of their job in a plant is to absorb some of the color spectrom of the sun light, which would explain the almost glow of the Glaciatas, as they would reflect more light then obsorb it? Just a guess. Anyway, thanks, Kent for that explanation, I think that helped me a lot. Now one thing remains, How do you know about horse color genetics? A horse can carry both of the genes, one for Tobiano, and one for Overo, and they will look mostly white with a few patches of other color. Can an iris carry both the Plicata, and the Emma Cook patterns? If they are separate alleles that should be possible. Wonder what they would look like?
Politicians are like diapers, they need to be changed often, and for the same reason.

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