Daylilies forum: Better to cut or cover?

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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 25, 2014 3:22 PM CST
I just used every decent sized pot and bucket I had to try and cover most of my "named" daylilies. I have already trimmed the foliage back twice this year and they were looking so good I just hated the thought of having to cut them back a third time. There are two nights of below freezing weather predicted, not way below but just below. So I am wondering is it better to cover them or just let them be exposed to the cold and cut them back every time it freezes. I have tons of unnamed ones spread all over, so there was no way to try and cover those, do people who have hundreds have covers for all of them, or do you just let them freeze over and over?
Yes I probably qualify for the tackiest garden award!

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MissMimie
Feb 25, 2014 4:11 PM CST
Seedfork, I don't cover my daylilies unless they are the 'tender' ones I shouldn't have bought in the first place.
[Last edited by MissMimie - Mar 11, 2014 5:50 PM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 25, 2014 4:22 PM CST
Ok, now remember I am not a daylily expert. What is meant by "tender" and how would you know before you bought it that it was "tender"?
Edited to add:
I researched "tender" found it to be the opposite of "Hardy", a very vague term it appears. That information is not registered, and appears to be almost a" garden by garden" thing. So I guess you would only know this information my "word of mouth" so to speak.
Hardiness zones I see would certainly be an indicator of "tenderness", I am learning.
[Last edited by Seedfork - Feb 25, 2014 7:29 PM (+)]
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Name: Debra
Nashville, TN (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Cat Lover Butterflies Region: Tennessee Seed Starter
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shive1
Feb 25, 2014 8:02 PM CST
I usually don't cover anything this time of year, since I have more than 600. The extreme cold will have them naturally die back to the ground. They will sprout back out when it warms up again. I have been known to cover my special ones when we get a cold snap in April or early May, particularly if they already have scapes coming.
[Last edited by shive1 - Mar 23, 2014 3:03 PM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 25, 2014 8:11 PM CST
shive1,
Thanks, for that response. I am wondering if by covering them it allows them to have an earlier bloom? Do the ones that are not protected seem to catch up too the ones that are protected and bloom at about the same time?
Edited to say:
If they do have scapes and they die back, how long does that delay the bloom time?
[Last edited by Seedfork - Feb 25, 2014 8:15 PM (+)]
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Name: Tina
Where the desert meets the sea (Zone 9b)
Daylilies Cactus and Succulents Container Gardener Dog Lover Birds Enjoys or suffers hot summers
Garden Ideas: Level 2
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chalyse
Feb 26, 2014 3:01 AM CST
First, I don't thing you have a tacky garden at all ... in fact, it looks kind of festive, those red and green pots! I do use some very effective "frost blanket" netting when we go into the 20's for a while - I originally didn't think it would work because it is so thin and has a webby weave, but it is very durable. I just anchor it with whatever is handy, since we also have a lot of wind.
(http://www.amazon.com/Dalen-Gardeneer-Harvest-Guard-Protecti...)

With the blanket, I'm seeing much earlier leaf growth than before (when I didn't use anything) but I don't know if that will translate into earlier blooming. I also have one plant in a bed I didn't protect and it ended up thinking the warmer weather this winter meant it was time to send up a scape (unsuccessfully) and so I, too, wonder if that will delay or eliminate having a scape on it to bloom later this year.
Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of old; seek what those of old sought. — Basho

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Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
Seller of Garden Stuff Region: United States of America Pollen collector Dragonflies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Region: Florida
Birds Butterflies Container Gardener Hummingbirder Garden Ideas: Level 2 Hosted a Not-A-Raffle-Raffle
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tink3472
Feb 26, 2014 7:28 AM CST
The only ones I covered were the new intros that were newly planted that more than likely had never seen one bit of cold since they came from down south. I covered them with big nursery pots mainly to keep the rain off of them which would freeze down in the fan. These look great, however, the ones that didn't get covered are catching up with them.
I've only lost a few of mine but if they would have been more established (I had not to long redid the beds) they probably would have made it.

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Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
Seller of Garden Stuff Region: United States of America Pollen collector Dragonflies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Region: Florida
Birds Butterflies Container Gardener Hummingbirder Garden Ideas: Level 2 Hosted a Not-A-Raffle-Raffle
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tink3472
Feb 26, 2014 7:35 AM CST
Seedfork said:Ok, now remember I am not a daylily expert. What is meant by "tender" and how would you know before you bought it that it was "tender"?
Edited to add:
I researched "tender" found it to be the opposite of "Hardy", a very vague term it appears. That information is not registered, and appears to be almost a" garden by garden" thing. So I guess you would only know this information my "word of mouth" so to speak.
Hardiness zones I see would certainly be an indicator of "tenderness", I am learning.


It's hard to know what is going to be tender or not. Even evergreens can be hardy in really cold climates while other evergreens don't stand a chance. Checking the data base before buying to see who is growing it in what area helps if it's not a really new one.
[url=www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com]www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com[/url]
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 8:14 AM CST
chalyse
Thanks for replying, festive...yes, I do like the sound of that, if I squint really hard... yes the garden looks festive, not tacky.
The fabric did not seem to receive very good reviews for frost protection, but you said you had very windy conditions, and I think that makes all the difference. It did receive very good reviews for providing early growth for plants, and the insect protection is of great interest to me for the vegetable garden.
So the decision is still out on weather or not the early protection actually results in earlier bloom? That totally baffles me about the uncovered plant sending up the early bloom stalk, seems it should have been the reverse. Does that plant normally bloom extra early? Weird. So is it possible that would actually have been the only scape sent up on that plant this year, hope not?
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 8:32 AM CST
tink3472
I appreciate the feedback. I have had two periods were the daylilies suffered hard freezes and I cut the leaves back. Now this late in the year (seems late, but maybe I am just rushing things) do the non protected plants have enough time to catch up with the protected ones. What if we were even a month more advanced in the year, and had a very late unexpected freeze, do you still think the frozen ones would have enough time to catch up with the protected ones, it just seems like there would have to be a time somewhere along the way when that would not be possible.
Tender...that term still gives me a little problem. My little study on the term did reveal that tender is often misused in in regard to Evergreen, and that local feed back is a possible source of information. I have been looking at the data base and often see very few people own certain daylilies, so that probably being one of the best sources available, it makes finding reliable information on tenderness very subjective it seems. Just out of curiosity I punched in Hardy only to zone 11, actually found one daylily listed, I guess that might qualify as tender?
My brother lives in Fairhope, so one day I may have to drive down to Cantonment, I used to always see that sign on the interstate when driving back and forth form Mobile. Are you open to the public?
Name: Debra
Nashville, TN (Zone 7a)
Daylilies Cat Lover Butterflies Region: Tennessee Seed Starter
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shive1
Feb 26, 2014 9:05 AM CST
In the past when I've covered daylilies, they seem to all bloom on the same schedule anyway. Since, I don't get a lot of rebloom, a frozen scape often means no bloom for the year for me. I've only lost scapes on extra early bloomers before.

Debra
Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
Seller of Garden Stuff Region: United States of America Pollen collector Dragonflies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Region: Florida
Birds Butterflies Container Gardener Hummingbirder Garden Ideas: Level 2 Hosted a Not-A-Raffle-Raffle
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tink3472
Feb 26, 2014 9:15 AM CST
Seedfork said:tink3472

My brother lives in Fairhope, so one day I may have to drive down to Cantonment, I used to always see that sign on the interstate when driving back and forth form Mobile. Are you open to the public?


We are not open to the public but anyone is welcome to stop by. I actually share a garden with James Hall so it's not actually my garden; I have all my plants at his place. So when you are going to be this way you can just shoot an email if you want to stop by.
[url=www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com]www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com[/url]
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 9:16 AM CST
shive1
So it seems daylilies have a built in schedule on when to send up scapes, and that is not altered by the freezes or by being protected. If the early scape does freeze that is it for the season, so the early ones would for sure need protection? Here, where hopefully I should get a lot of rebloom, I guess that would not be so vitally important, but I still love to get very early and very late blooms in the garden.
Have others noticed the same pattern, the daylilies seem to bloom at the same time weather protected or not?
[Last edited by Seedfork - Feb 26, 2014 9:19 AM (+)]
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 9:17 AM CST
tink3472
Thank! Smiling
Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
Seller of Garden Stuff Region: United States of America Pollen collector Dragonflies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Region: Florida
Birds Butterflies Container Gardener Hummingbirder Garden Ideas: Level 2 Hosted a Not-A-Raffle-Raffle
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tink3472
Feb 26, 2014 9:44 AM CST
[quote="Seedfork"]tink3472

Tender...that term still gives me a little problem. My little study on the term did reveal that tender is often misused in in regard to Evergreen, and that local feed back is a possible source of information. I have been looking at the data base and often see very few people own certain daylilies, so that probably being one of the best sources available, it makes finding reliable information on tenderness very subjective it seems. Just out of curiosity I punched in Hardy only to zone 11, actually found one daylily listed, I guess that might qualify as tender?
quote]

In the data base the hardiness listed I believe is a generalized thing going by the USDA zone/hardiness maps, I could be wrong though. I remember before the database was revamped and I was adding info this is how I was told to list the hardiness Dormant =zone 3, Semi-evergreen= zone 4a and Evergreen = zone 5a. This still does not mean that the plants are actually hardy in those zones, it's just giving generalized info about it.

The one daylily you are referring to (Flip, Flop, Fly??) is listed as Max zone 11 but minimum is zone 4 so it would not be a tender plant going by that. It was hybridized in Ohio so I doubt it would be tender if this is the one you are talking about.

And YES it is very subjective indeed. Things that I consider tender here may do well in a colder climate. My issue here is we are usually warm (or not too cold) in the winter so the plants grow then when/if we get a freeze the tender, new growth turns to mush and then we get warm or hot and the mush turns to rot and if that doesn't hurt the plant (I spray for it) and new growth starts popping up then we get a freeze and the new growth gets zapped again and then that mush turns to rot once it warms up again. If it just stayed cold the whole winter and the foliage died instead of turning to mush then the tender ones here may not be tender.
[url=www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com]www.pensacoladaylilyclub.com[/url]
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 10:02 AM CST
tink3472
Thanks again. Being the terms semi-evergreen, evergreen, and dormant are to some extent not an exact science to start with, and if the hardiness zones for daylilies are very generalized, I think as just an everyday gardener, I will just not worry too much about tenderness. I will lose a few plants here and there for one reason or another, and if someone asks what happened to your poor daylily I will respond "oh, it was just too tender for this area". They will probably accept that an never question my poor gardening skills. Rolling on the floor laughing
Name: Mike
Hazel Crest, IL (Zone 5b)
There's a place of quiet rest !
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Hazelcrestmikeb
Feb 26, 2014 10:25 AM CST
Seedfork, I don't cover anything here. If it's a new plant and it is small I will put a cage around it to protect it from the digging squirrels until the roots get establish. All my seedlings are currently buried under two feet of snow. If you cover a plant "mainly new arrivals) don't forget to keep it watered since your cover will deflect the rain and and snow and cause them to dry out.
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Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
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Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 10:36 AM CST
tink3472,
Yes, "Flip, Flop and Fly", I just entered "Minimum Cold Hardiness zone 11", when I entered "Minimum Cold Hardiness zone 2" I got zero. Am I confused (again) I took that to mean that zone 11 was the coldest zone for "Flip, Flop and Fly" and that no daylilies were able to grow (under normal circumstances) in zone 2. Am I reading that wrong, or is the data base not correct, help me understand.
Name: Larry
Enterprise, Al. 36330 (Zone 8b)
Region: Alabama Composter Garden Photography Garden Ideas: Master Level Plant Identifier Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Image
Seedfork
Feb 26, 2014 10:46 AM CST
Thanks Mike,
As if you couldn't tell it is raining here today, and I am stuck inside (explains all the posting).
I only have to cover my plants for a few days at a time, the temp. just drops down below freezing normally for short periods. This time the plants will be covered from Tuesday afternoon through Friday morning. Being the plants have individual covers not an entire area covered I think even for a more extended period the moisture level would be fine.
I do have a few daylilies and "Regular Lilies" under plastic that have been there since early in the year when I bought them and those I do have to water on a regular basis. I do get concerned about the plants under pots that don't let the light penetrate, don't know what effect that might have on them.
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Name: Michele
Cantonment, FL zone 8b
Seller of Garden Stuff Region: United States of America Pollen collector Dragonflies I was one of the first 300 contributors to the plant database! Region: Florida
Birds Butterflies Container Gardener Hummingbirder Garden Ideas: Level 2 Hosted a Not-A-Raffle-Raffle
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tink3472
Feb 26, 2014 1:46 PM CST
Seedfork said:tink3472,
Yes, "Flip, Flop and Fly", I just entered "Minimum Cold Hardiness zone 11", when I entered "Minimum Cold Hardiness zone 2" I got zero. Am I confused (again) I took that to mean that zone 11 was the coldest zone for "Flip, Flop and Fly" and that no daylilies were able to grow (under normal circumstances) in zone 2. Am I reading that wrong, or is the data base not correct, help me understand.


For whatever reason it lists Zone 4 and Zone 11 as the minimum if you go into the plants info, I don't know why maybe a typo. Since FLIP, FLOP, FLY was hybridized in Ohio then it is most definitely hardy in other zones.
I don't go by hardiness zones for plants usually because to me they don't seem accurate at least in the areas I have been in. I lived in Naples, FL (zone 10a) and the hardiness map says min temps are 30-35 and unless it has changed a great deal since I was there I would say that those temps are way off because it never got below 80 when I was there. People went to the beach in the winter because it was wayyyyy too hot in the summer to go. For here it says our min temps are 10-15 and15-20 (we kind of verge on 2 zones) and unless we have a fluke winter like this year then our min temps are usually in the 30-40 range and that's maybe for a month.

I'm not sure how cold you get there ( I see you are in the same zone as me) but you really should be able to grow all foliage habits of daylilies with no problems even if a plant is tender (if you ever figure out what that truly means). And foliage habits also don't equate to hardiness or tenderness of a plant IMHO.

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[Last edited by tink3472 - Feb 26, 2014 1:48 PM (+)]
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