One of the crosses was Wild One x Galaxy Explosion. The other was Galaxy Explosion x ZZZ37 (Galaxy Explosion x Lily Munster).

Maybe crossing with Galaxy Explosion caused a problem? Though I do believe that ZZZ37 has another pod out there still developing and has not opened like the previous pod.

beckygardener said:Maybe crossing with Galaxy Explosion caused a problem?

Quite possibly.

Though I do believe that ZZZ37 has another pod out there still developing and has not opened like the previous pod.

Is that also a cross back to 'Galaxy Explosion'?

Thanks everyone...

I have left this one alone to see if it will mature and if the seeds will be viable. Memory has me believing that this was a typical bloom and not a poly. The cross was Lees Loss x NOID (below)




I also have another pod on separate CV that just doesn't quite look right but, I currently do not have a picture.

Maurice - the other ZZZ37 pod does indeed have Galaxy Explosion (in it's cross) which is the exact same cross as one of the defective pods previously. I don't have any more pods bursting open like that.

I also have pods that seem to be rotting from the base of the pod (where it attaches to the scape). Very soft and squishy at the base. They seemed to be developing normally until now. I assume either bugs got into the pods or the pods (which are large) did not produce any seeds. (Like a false pregnancy.) It is interesting that the pods are quite large and still green like a developing pod, but they are starting to decay from the base of the pod upwards to the top of the pod. I have several different crosses doing that on several seedlings and registered cultivars. Any idea what might cause that?

beckygardener said:I also have pods that seem to be rotting from the base of the pod (where it attaches to the scape). Very soft and squishy at the base. They seemed to be developing normally until now. I assume either bugs got into the pods or the pods (which are large) did not produce any seeds. (Like a false pregnancy.) It is interesting that the pods are quite large and still green like a developing pod, but they are starting to decay from the base of the pod upwards to the top of the pod. I have several different crosses doing that on several seedlings and registered cultivars. Any idea what might cause that?

Sorry, I don't have any specific ideas. How old are the pods? Since they are quite large I will assume weeks rather than days. Have you opened any of those pods? Do they have seeds in them?

Becky, the ones that went bad on Stella de Oro did something similar, they looked green but started to get soft. Then wrinkled. They all ended completely brown and so thin as if they were empty. The ones that are growing now seems to be fine. Are we sure it's not temperature related? Or humidity related?

So will polys give you six chambers??

Gleni said:So will polys give you six chambers??

Usually the same number as the number of petals.
See
http://www.daylilies.org/ahs_d...

Maurice ( admmad ) Didn't we have a discussion about the multi-chambered pod last year where we considered that it could be because the stigma had multiple parts? I was thinking about that this past week as I was pollinating some of my daylilies because a couple of them had stigmas with more than 3 tubules (my word...I don't know if it's right or not).

That was supposed to have tagged Maurice. Here we go: @admmad

DogsNDaylilies said:Maurice ( admmad ) Didn't we have a discussion about the multi-chambered pod last year where we considered that it could be because the stigma had multiple parts? I was thinking about that this past week as I was pollinating some of my daylilies because a couple of them had stigmas with more than 3 tubules (my word...I don't know if it's right or not).

I expect that we did have that discussion. Yes, I expect that multi-chambered pods (more than three chambers) are caused by pistils with stigmas that have more than three parts (lobes).

@admmad - Here are some photos of the "rotting" seed pods. I've never seen this happen before, but when I opened the pods, I could see some of the seed were rotting. What would cause this? Too much moisture? The plant is in an area that gets morning shade.

Pod:


What it looked like when I opened the pod:


Some of the seeds were hard and some were squishy. All the seeds were black.

Squishy seeds:


I think pulling the pod may have saved some of the seeds that likely would have rotted as well. I have the rest of the seeds drying to see if they indeed survive.

I had some do that last year. I really don't know what causes it.

Im very interested in the read about multi chambered pods and pistils with stigmas having multi lobes. Is there more info or studies of this nature?

Becky, I hope your seed, saved are viable.

@Beckygardener I would not expect that excess moisture by itself would cause the pods to rot. If there are good seeds in the pods, the pods should not simply abort as they would if none of the seeds were good. If the seed pod is physically damaged in some way then it is possible that they might rot. That would presumably require bacteria or some microorganism getting into the damaged area. Excess moisture would enable the microorganisms to grow.

Although I do not know of an insect that damages daylily seed pods specifically in that manner, there might be insects that suck juices from plant tissues (like aphids) but that use firmer tissues, like scapes or seed pods. Sue @Sooby may have a much better idea of what might cause appropriate damage that could lead to rotting.

GaNinFl said:Is there more info or studies of this nature?

Sorry, I don't know of any specific studies in daylilies. There may be more general studies that look at the genetics of flower formation, particularly at doubling. The situation in some flowers may be related to polymerous daylilies. In those the extra flower parts tend to be modular, that is, additional modules are added to the normal three of a daylily flower. A module in this case being one sepal, one petal, one stamen for each of those and one extra set of parts in the pistil including an extra stigmatic lobe. There are likely to be genes (structural) that determine each separate part and other genes that regulate those structural genes. A mutation in a regulatory gene might cause one or more extra entire modules to be made while a mutation in a specific structural gene might cause only one extra part of a module to be made - in some cases just of the pistil perhaps.

Thanks Maurice,
I received recently, the publication 'Double Daylilis: Twice the Fun' and am enjoying it very much. Lots of photos and the history of doubles. It has a chapter explaining the double form, but also includes the other forms as well.

Thanks again

admmad said:

Although I do not know of an insect that damages daylily seed pods specifically in that manner, there might be insects that suck juices from plant tissues (like aphids) but that use firmer tissues, like scapes or seed pods. Sue @Sooby may have a much better idea of what might cause appropriate damage that could lead to rotting.

I would suspect some kind of "true bug", there are several that are potential pests of daylilies. At least some can inject what is sometimes referred to as a "toxin" although I think I recall that it may be some kind of growth regulator. The tarnished plant bug (Lygus lineolaris) is one that comes to mind In that category although we don't know exactly what damage it does to daylilies - it tends to go for reproductive parts of plants. I once found a TPB nymph on some damaged and rotting daylily stamens. Another might, and I stress might, be a milkweed bug because it is a seed feeder and has been noted on daylilies although could just be hanging out. You may have difficulty noticing "true bugs" because they are much more mobile than something that stays in place feeding for long periods like an aphid. Adult bugs will often duck under a leaf or bud when you approach, and the young nymphs are tiny and far more agile than an aphid. If you have any cool mornings there, have a look for something like that. They tend to be more sluggish when it's cool. Get a picture to post if you see a possible suspect.

Thanks Maurice and Sue!

I do have Milkweed Bugs here because I garden for Butterflies and have Milkweed plants. And I believe I have seen Tarnished Bugs here as well. Heck, I live in Florida .... so it seems to me that I have just about everything imaginable!

I always have Milkweed bugs in my yard, but this is the first year I've seen Daylily pods do that. So it may be a Tarnished bug or some similar bug causing the damage to my pods.

I opened up a pod yesterday and found numerous seeds including one that was sprouting! So I planted it and 5 others (from the same seed pod).

Which of course leads me to believe that you do NOT have to refrigerator your seeds for 6 weeks before sowing .....