Yes, that is often the case. I do understand that some northern hybridizers also have their plants tested in different locations, so I assume if they demonstrated rebloom in the southern gardens they would be registered that way. That is just my understanding not positive how that works.

Yes, but I can see how if the hybridizer did not consider bud building a rebloom, and the plant sent up additional scapes he would still list it as a rebloomer.

Seedfork said:Yes, that is often the case. I do understand that some northern hybridizers also have their plants tested in different locations, so I assume if they demonstrated rebloom in the southern gardens they would be registered that way. That is just my understanding not positive how that works.

They should not do that. The registration instructions state that to check yes for rebloom it must rebloom in the registrant's own garden.

I wondered about that Sue. Thanks for clarifying that whatever is registered is supposed to be in the hybridizer's stats according to the daylily growing in their own garden.

I didnt know that Sue. That is valuable information. After registration, can the hybridizer report on their own website, or on this database, whether rebloom has been noted in different climates/conditions?

The AHS registration form asks for several stats, but being a bud-builder is not one of them. Bud-building is not rebloom.
All buds that form on a scape count toward bud count only. The count is achieved by counting bud scars after bloom is completely finished. It is advised to average the number of bud scars from scapes during one season. That would include rebloom. The average between high number and low number scars is the number that should be entered onto the registration form.
Registration information is to be entered as to how the daylily performs in the hybridizer's garden. Any other information is anecdotal and is not included in the registration.

amberjewel said:I didnt know that Sue. That is valuable information. After registration, can the hybridizer report on their own website, or on this database, whether rebloom has been noted in different climates/conditions?

A hybridizer can put whatever they wish on their own website and would also, hopefully, update the database here. They may also change their AHS registration info (with a fee) to include updates to their stats on a cultivar.

judydu2 said:

A hybridizer can put whatever they wish on their own website and would also, hopefully, update the database here. They may also change their AHS registration info (with a fee) to include updates to their stats on a cultivar.

Could they update whether the cultivar reblooms in warmer climates or do the updated stats still have to be from their own garden? I

I had never thought about counting the scars after all blooms are done! I am trying to keep track of how many blooms I am getting on my plants (named cultivars) just because I'm curious if stats in my garden match the AHS stats. Counting the scars would keep me from being so paranoid about being gone for any length of time and missing blooms!

amberjewel said:

Could they update whether the cultivar reblooms in warmer climates or do the updated stats still have to be from their own garden?

In their own garden.

I have two daylilies known for budbuilding. And they do. Final Touch and Crimson Pirate. They have not ever rebloomed for me. I have a couple others to check on. On a budbuilders, almost all of the blooms will be gone, you will see green at the top where a bloom was and wonder did a bloom fertilize or is it a bud. It can take a little while to tell which is happening. Becky has a good picture of tip. But to the naked eye at that size you would not be sure. Meaning an average person. I do not think you can count budbuilding blooms in. When showing dried scapes or pictures of scapes, two blooms share one scar. Many blessings for a wonderful week!

I'll have to keep my eye on Final Touch - it bloomed day before yesterday. I noticed when I dug out the weeds surrounding it that grew during my vacation. Still have more to do but I have a little over half of that chore done. I didn't know that Final Touch has a reputation for bud building. Maybe that is why it kept blooming for me until November. Something to look for!

How often does bud building occur in the daylily population?

Barb

Amber I know very little on this subject but if it's blooms you desire pluck any and all seed pods you don't desire. Not always easy with some varieties but I prefer blooms to pods with exception to pods created by crossing. JMHO.

Barb--it is a rare trait. Until this year only the two I mentioned before did it for me. I had another one that is a rebloomer do it this year, Will Return. However, I have not seen any rebloom on it. Final Touch grows prolifs, too. I do not know if I have gotten bud building and prolifs from the same scape. Some people I think may knock buds off, they think it is a bee pod. If you are a quick empty scape cutter you would not know. I have seen budbuilding with some buds left and with the scape empty.I had one at home that I wanted to keep an eye on. It had buds, green tips, but the tips started looking different from each other. I thought bee pods and bud building. But I left Saturday to visit my daughter in the hill country. Now I do not remember which one. This year Crimson Pirate had a poor show and did not do any budbuilding. It stayed green all year and it is a dormant. Which might be a new topic, losing dormant daylilies in warming climates. May joy and peace surround you!

@judydu2,
Is there a official or scientific source for your conclusion that bud building is not rebloom. I admit there is no such source for my assumption that bud building was rebloom. I am more than willing to accept that bud building is not rebloom, but I would like to know the source of your determination. Has there been official discussions by the AHS about bud building not being considered rebloom, is the way the form for registration is laid out indicative that bud building would not be considered rebloom, etc.? How or what determined for you that bud building was not rebloom?
I am not challenging you statement, I am not defending mine, I would just like a much more detailed knowledge of what is and is not considered rebloom.

My plan this year was to collect the dead scapes at the end of the year and count the bud scars. I saw that as the perfect solution. I found out that in reality that did not work for me. There were several things that seemed to work against that plan. I can see it could be done for a select few plants such as the ones being considered for registration. In my garden the old dying scapes became a huge eye sore so I began to intentionally pull them all as they became easy to detach from the plant. But in just the day to day deadheading of the blooms and pulling the dead leaves I would often dislodge the old dying scapes. Also with rust being a big problem here the old scapes became a source of the disease spreading.

I think 'Flamingo Flambeau' has done some bud building this year. It began blooming on May 29 and there are still a couple of buds left. That's a long bloom period . The ends of some of the scapes have a spiral shape. Since they are original scapes I don't consider it rebloom but it definitely makes for a longer bloom season. To compare, 'Orange You Clever' finished blooming yesterday and it started blooming on May 17, but it accomplished that by sending up some new scapes.

@Donald, if the bud building had been done on rebloom scapes, then would you have considered that to be reboom?

@Seedfork
Yes. I think my take is on when the scape shows up, not the bloom. So if the bud building occurs on the initial scapes I'd consider the blooms on that scape as initial blooms, but if it occurs on a rebloom scape then all the blooms would be rebloom. To me, bud building is its own characteristic separate from the rebloom trait. It extends the bloom period on either initial scapes or on rebloom scapes. If it were to be classed as rebloom, then bud building on a rebloom scape would have to be considered a third rebloom, wouldn't it? I'm easy, though. I'll take either/any definition along with those extra blooms.

Daylilies usually have determinate inflorescences (scapes).

Bud-building is scientifically called "indeterminate inflorescence," meaning "continuing to grow at the apex" or in the case of daylilies, the tip/terminal end of the scape.

Rebloom is defined as having more than one cycle of flowering per year.

While those more learned than myself may be able to, I can not point you to any specific or noted *scientific* studies that will "prove" the difference between rebloom and bud- building.

judydu2 said:Daylilies usually have determinate inflorescences (scapes).

Bud-building is scientifically called "indeterminate inflorescence," meaning "continuing to grow at the apex" or in the case of daylilies, the tip/terminal end of the scape.

Rebloom is defined as having more than one cycle of flowering per year.

While those more learned than myself may be able to, I can not point you to any specific or noted *scientific* studies that will "prove" the difference between rebloom and bud- building.

I consider the bud-building on my scapes to still be the original blooming cycle. I have seen some sellers referred to their plants as having an "extended blooming season". Is that a general reference to bud-building not to be confused with the "extended bloom" trait that indicates when each individual bloom remains open for greater than 16 hours?