Thanks for the great information on pollinating Kevin!

Gosh, I live in Wisconsin and never even heard of Alpine Gardens! However, when I googled them, two Alpine Gardens in Wisconsin came up. I think the one you've contacted is in Monroe, WI. My husband just said that we can take a motorcycle ride there one of these weekends, so I will pick you up a list.

Sounds like you've got your work cut out for you building new gardens. Can't wait to see pictures!

Chris,

Yes that's the one. I looked for a web site but found none although they are listed on "places to visit" lists.

Rainy day here in the Willamette Valley here in OR but I'll take this compared to the 100F+ the rest of the country is suffering through.

The previous owner put in about a 1/2 acre area in gravel. Have been debating exactly what to do with it as it is an eyesore to me although convenient when i have garden tours! My plan is to cover at least half of it in raised beds and do either all semps and sedums or some in dwarf irises edged with semps. Think both combos would be nice. I can keep the gravel between the beds as paths and that will improve the drainage of the beds that are built on top.

Lynn,

OH OH now I have a competitor here in OR! Actually it is such fun I'll predict you'll be addicted. Think outside the box and make some unusual combinations of parents so we don't have "more of the same" That 10" cobweb is just around the corner! and i'll be your first customer!

Kevin

I'll let you work on the 10" cobweb Kevin. It almost scares me to think you might be right about me having another obsession.
I'm still trying to figure out what part of the bloom is what, and when do I cut of the parts that are suppose to come off?
I've been looking at close ups of bloom photos trying to figure it all out. Sure hope I learn before all the blooms are gone.

I remember you saying something about the mother plant determining growth pattern? Is that correct? Or was it color?
And what does the father plant contribute to the cross?
I knew I should have been taking notes.

Wish you had time to come over and show me the process. Maybe I could send some plants home with you?

I've got to admit, I'm a bit confused by the flower parts too. So when you get to this point: "The day before the flower is to open remove all the anthers on the flower to be pollinated" are the flowers just open a little bit so you can reach in and remove them? I'd really love to give this a try too!

I think your raised beds would be beautiful with either combination.

Chris,

Yes the flower will almost be open the day before, the petals are straight up and down but have not dropped to their final position. Go in at that time and pull of the pollen bearing anthers with fine tweezers on the pod parent.

Lynn, yes the maternal parent often has a greater effect on the plant characteristics but most genes will be inherited from both parents. And i thought you might be my first customer for the 10" cobweb, especially since the leaves will be BLACK. Do I have you yet? I feel like a drug pusher somehow. Of course you know I have it bad as I cross everything in my yard as I have to know "just how they are inherited" or "I bet I can make this better".

You might want to pot up a few blooming ones so you can study the flower parts and do the crosses at your leisure. Just put them in a sunny window and cross like crazy. In the house you won't have to cover the plants either.

Good luck.

Kevin

I'm placing an order with you right now Kevin, for that black 10" cobweb. Holding you to it. No backing out now.

Okay, I am going to give this a try.
I have another question. When I go to get the donor pollen flower, how do I know if a bee hasn't carried pollen and deposited it on the donor bloom? Never mind, I think I remember you saying to place a bag (my mother's nylon stockings) over the bloom s before they open.

Kevin, I think I'll hold out for that 10" arach in a crested form. Lynn has more space, I need to specialize. Now if it was a variegated black 10" arach, I might order a few!

By any chance, do you know Gary Gossett, how to reach him or anything about the Pacific series?

Kevin I thought you might like to see this bloom on Griggs Surprise, belonging to goldfinch (Chris). Are these blooms usually viable for pollination? Which way would you cross it? This be the parent plant, or the donor plant? Or both way?
http://garden.org/thread/view_...

Well I'm glad I have at least 1 customer for my 10' black cobweb!

On Gary Gossett, I met him in '96 when in Oregon at a hosta convention. He worked for Terra Nova, the plant breeding company, for a while but I think he has parted ways with them now. He is still in the Portland area and one of my nursery contacts said he was "trying to get back into semps". I thought of trying to look him up through my contacts and Cynda and i have already cooked up a lunch for Lynn, Gary, Cynda and myself if this all comes to pass. Gary was in the original semp round robin that included Helen Payne, Sandy MacPherson, Bill Nixon, Mina Colvin, Patty Drown, Ed Skrocki and myself. Yes those were some MOST INTERESTING letters that were circulated.

I have most but not all of Gary's hybrids and think they are great. They are already being used in crossing. He was reaching his peak after I was out of it because of grad school and a move to a semp-inhospitable climate.

We corresponded a couple times when he was still at Terra Nova but i haven't heard anything since then.

Lynn, most days here a paper bag over the top the night before will keep your pollen just fine. also take an EARLY walk in the garden before the bees are really active. of course TODAY it is raining here in Salem. No crosses of any kind, althugh I'm sure the rest of the country would trade our 72F HIGH for whatever they have!

Kevin.

Lynn,

Our posts crossed in cyber space!

The blooms on all of the mixed up semps sort of look like that. The one time 'Weirdo' bloomed for me in MA it did that too. Some of these plants that sported from a normal semp might be chimeras, that is one layer of tissue is mutant but the rest is normal. Occasionally when an offset arrives from just the normal tissue you get a "reversion" to the original. 'Oddity' does that rather often. So when you use these plants in breeding they sometimes behave just like original plant from which it sported. In other cases if pollen and/ or ovules is derived from mutant tissue you do get some but not all of the progeny that exhibit the mutant characteristics. Actually if you got a seedling that was JUST the mutant tissue it might be more like what 'Weirdo' is at it seems to exhibit several abnormalities.

'Weirdo' appeared as a SEEDLING so I'm assuming it was genetically homogeneous, all mutant.

Hope that helps!

Kevin

I am going out this afternoon to see if I can form a plan on which ones I might like to cross. If anything clicks in my head, I will cover with paper bags this evening, cutting off all opened blooms first.

I am not complaining at all about our weather, might a little later this summer.

If we get the opportunity to have a gathering with you, me, Cynda and Gary Gossett I'm bringing a note pad. I was so disappointed in myself for not doing that when I came to your place a couple of weeks ago. Hopefully I will not repeat that mistake.

How is the 10" black cobweb coming along? : )

Lynn, May I suggest you take a video camera??? <please!>

Maybe I could just call our local news station and have them follow us around?

You would want the group to maintain the rights, be able to post on utube, make dvd's etc. You want the valuable information to be available to the plant growers not the corporate conglomerates. Right?

Okay, so maybe I could use my DD's camera, mount it on a tripod and video it? Wish I would have thought of that when Cynda and I went to Kevin's place.

How about a video tour, with permission, of some of the plants. A round table discussion on video would be wonderful, but everyone would need to agree. Take the plant world high tech with a podcast or three. You could do a "semp of the week" feature from your gardens. Ask Dave when he's going to enhance the offerings with pod casts? Bring on the mpg's

Wow you guys want to make me a TV star! Actually I did a spot on P. Allen Smith's show about ten years ago on how one hybridizes and the basic processes. I have a VCR copy so you know that technology is long gone. It may be available in a more modern format. Allen is a very good interviewer and quite a character himself.

I am in the process of getting some more plants in and was also doing a little crossing and realized "I NEED MORE ROOM" so quickly constructed a 20' x 5' bed and have plans to construct 3 more for all the seedlings I'll be raising. Looks as though all sorts of cultivars are going to bloom this year and there could be some interesting combinations. I might not get my 10" black cobweb but I'm betting I get some good seedlings out of these crosses. It is a numbers game though. Most are like mom or dad and it's the 1% that make you happy, not the 99% all-so-rans.

Then after you grow them up, you have to make selections. One that Cynda liked was one I hadn't given a lot of thought but now hat she has remarked as liking it, I decided to give it a chance. It has the same sort of hues as Helen Payne's 'Elene' but it looks to be a larger rosette and retains its color much better. Sort of an interesting combo of shiny leaves and fringe on the leaves too. Anyway probably good to have more than one set of eyes go through the seedling patch. You have a new job Lynn!

When I was a kid Bill Nixon would come for a visit several times / year and of course I lived on the same street with Polly Bishop and Patty Drown. I sent pieces of anything I was considering naming to Helen and Ed Skrocki. That would give you a fairly good cross section of people saying "Yeah I like that too" or "Kevin that isn't your best work". It was a fun time as here were so many interesting things happening. Even after all these years 'Jungle Shadows' and 'Lipstick' still look quite remarkable to me so you can imagine my excitement when they occurred in my garden in '69 and '70.

I played in the 4th of July concert in Monomouth last night Lynn. Should have emailed you.

Kevin

Oh no Kevin. I so wish you would have let me know you were playing.

Cynda has such good taste in semps, bet it's going to be a keeper. I'm holding out for that 10" black cobweb. I know you can do it.

My little bee seedlings are really growing fast, some are starting to distinguish themselves from the others. What fun it is to watch the changes taking place.

I love watching P. Allen Smith, will have to see if there is a way to find and watch the older episodes.

Kevin, when do I start my new job?

That's a pretty good sized bed to quickly put together Kevin! What fun to see all the results from your new crosses.

Can we see a photo Kevin?