Marilyn said:

I can't get apps. Don't have a phone and/or a browser that can get and use apps. That's what I was trying to say in my previous post.

Marilyn, you use a browser to browse the web (IE, Firefox, etc.) so go ahead and click on the Webapps tab.

Ric this is the weather link I use for gardening http://www.weather.com/activit...

My guess is that it will come down to "what data can be pulled in automatically by ZIP", and Dave can auto-populate those if he decides to. Everything else will have to be editable by the member. Probably the auto fields also need to be user-editable, since some ZIP codes contain varied micro-climates.

Not many members will want to go into the statistical detail that has been discussed recently (like, % cloud cover per month, or cloudy days per month).

My image was that there would be optional fields like those in the Plant Database. Some radio buttons or check-boxes, and then an "other" field for free form text. You might be able to check "frequently overcast winters" and "clear dry summers", but would have to type by hand something like "many gray, cool foggy mornings but sunny and hot by noon.

Some balance would have to be struck between ease of entry for new members, and the kin d of detail loved by nerds. Whenever I write or design something, wiser people tell me that I like too much detail! Yes, I do!

Or, asking for the Sun, the Moon and the Stars, perhaps one "short form" that most people would enjoy checking off and entering comments/complaints into (what gardener can resist complaining about their weather?) ...
...
... and then an "Advanced Climate Data Entry Button" that would offer the option of entering different comments for each season or each month. Different regions care about different things, like dates of scorching heat in summer, frequency of late cold snaps, which seasons have the worst winds, etc.

Sometimes, just being confronted with a place to record the data tempts me into paying closer attention. I don't know, like a year-by-year list of "actual, observed SERIOUS" frosts in my exact microclimate and what I consider a "serious" frost.

Susan,

That's a great site! Now I have to find room in signature block!

And, if I list a friend's ZIP c ode, I can (pretend to) be knowledgeable about what-to-do-when in their zone! "Have you fertilized your Arulgula yet?)

I love the idea of having the ability to enter growing information for my particular area, for each month:
Soil temperature
Soil moisture
The above two are very important for us, this determines when we can plant. There are years the soil warms up sufficiently to plant out seedling, but the water table is to high.
Cloud cover days
Sun days
Rain days

I love this site for my weather information. It gives lat. lon. and elevation for my area. http://www.wunderground.com/we...

Susan's site gives a different forecast than the one I use. The one I use agrees with the thermometer and barometer we have.

Lynn, pretty good site I saved your link to my favorites.

It is right on for me. Not sure how it does for other areas.
I know our local golf courses us it also.

Calif_Sue said:

Marilyn, you use a browser to browse the web (IE, Firefox, etc.) so go ahead and click on the Webapps tab.

Thanks Sue!

Didn't want you missing out on this great feature!

Lynn, good site . It is even showing a tropical storm warning in the Indian Ocean.
Regards,
Arif.

I'm thinking that the very detailed monthly climate data suggestions are more like database features than "Profile" features.

It would take a large and complex database to hold and display that much climate information. I doubt that one record per participant would be enough! One per participant per month might be enough, but those would still be BIG records!

Our public profiles probably need to stay fairly simple and easy to understand. They might still benefit from a "regional description" or "climate" screen with fairly simple info - some annual or seasonal stats plus some check boxes plus some text fields.

But a public profile should be a "quick read" and very easy to fill out or update.

Proposed Stats: auto-populated by ZIP but editable by the member
- - USDA Hardiness Zone - average winter low temp, also display avg low temp
- - Sunset Climate Zone
- - first & last frost dates (50% and 90%)
- - length of frost-free growing season
- - rainfall (per season or per year)
- - avg. summer high temp.
?? - degree days based on 50 degrees
?? - % Cloud cover days (per season or year)
?? - % Rain days (per season or year)

Several of the very detailed fields suggested for month-to-month data entry might be summarized in the profile by members, using optional checkboxes or text fields.
Things like:
- humidity extremes,
- highly variable daylight hours,
- pronounced wet and dry seasons
- sometimes requires protection from rain
- sometimes requires irrigation or hand watering
- high winds
- flat or steep terrain
- valley, mountain, plains, semi-desert, desert, boggy
- urban, suburban, rural, forested, farm country
- soil type (include an option meaning 'I only grow in highly-amended beds or containers"

Going beyond climate & region, there might be a profile screen for checkboxes & text fields describing member's interests & practices, like
- grow in containers, raised beds, in-the-ground,
- grow-for-market, propagate cuttings, sell plants, save seeds, trade seeds, sell seeds
- primary interests like crops, perennials, annual flowers, specific plant types, etc .

But that opened yet another wish-list topic .


Detailed Climate Data base (per month per participating member):
- length of daylight hours (on the 21st of each month)
- avg humidity & extremes
- # or % of cloudy days, sunny days, rain days
- # of frost days
- # of high wind days
- precip total & daily extremes
- need for irrigation or protection from rain
- temp average & extremes
- degree days per month or week & cumulative

I'm still trying to list ALL suggestions or daydreams ... a list that would probably need to be whittled down.

Rick the log book idea was not to bloat up the database. It was more like a place to put down the data in a convenient place. The database will only have the monthly average, subsequent years same months again average them to a single digit for that month. Except for the person who is inputting the data and the database operators, an average person will only end up going cross eyed reading the complete story. As to Zip codes only the US and a few others may have the luxury the rest, no.
Regards,
Arif.

Hi Arif

>> an average person will only end up going cross eyed reading the complete story

I agree!

I'm most interested in the idea of a concise "Profile page" so I can look up someone's situation when they report something like "I can't ever grow XYZ", or "Those are easy, just plant them in September".

I can look at their Profile in a separate tab or window, and understand why their experience is so different from mine.

I think that most recommended practices and experience are only truly relevant to the situation they came from ... unless you can guess WHY something did or didn't work for that person. Then you can adapt their experience to your own situation.

For example, I gave up on reading about "Zone 8a" when it related to hot Texas summers instead of cool Pacific NorthWest summers.

>> As to Zip codes only the US and a few others may have the luxury the rest, no.

That brings up something I keep thinking, but have not yet figured out. Woofie hinted at it with the idea of a "Profile Search" feature. How will we find people with similar climates to our own?

ZIP c odes don't help- much because they are both one-to-many and also several-to-one. Many ZIP codes and regions all over the world will be similar, but how do you find the similar ones?

Some ZIP codes will have very different climates, for example one that spans a valley and a mountain.

There ought to be some way to cross-link something so that you can associate similar climates.

Being able to search on check boxes like "arid" or "frigid" or "pronounced wet-dry season" or "Sunset Climate Zone" might be a start. Maybe it would have to be a manual operation where we would hunt for similar regions and then "link" to them.

I think that calls for a lot of thought before it could be implemented usefully.

There are some generic climate descriptions that might be useful as starting points. We could each categorize our situation into the closest macro-climate group or groups and then refine it from there.

The only macro-climate groups I can think of so far are:
alpine
arid
monsoon
rain forest
"Mediterranean climate" (wet winter, mild dry summer)
frigid
tropical

Seasonal climate?
Winter: Dec. thru April/May, wet, lows in the 20's some years in the teens, day time 30's to 40's, .
Spring: wet 40's to 50's daytime. 30's to 40's night time.
Summer: July onward, dry, night time in the 50's to 60's, daytime 70's to 90's.
Fall: Oct & Nov, dry, night time in the 50's, daytime in the 60's to 80's.

Last spring frost first to second week in May.

Calif_Sue said:Didn't want you missing out on this great feature!

I think, just put up a colour coded world map. People can look up their area and click on it. Clicking on it can show up who ever is in that area. Going through the database or whatever is not possible for normal people. People who have an interest, maybe researchers let them have the long option.
Regards,
Arif.

Rick on this click-able map in order to reduce the hits some search parameters can be put in. Off hand I can think of a radial search of lets say ten miles and then increasing. Lynn is correct. In hilly or mountainous area there is climate change going on according to gradient every ten miles or so.
Lynn, these zones being set for you all must be averages of a certain given area. They might not be taking into consideration a 10000 feet peak in the middle of a flat arid desert. Which problem like you, I am also in.
Regards,
Arif.

>> Going through the database or whatever is not possible for normal people. People who have an interest, maybe researchers let them have the long option.

I agree with you!

>> People can look up their area and click on it. Clicking on it can show up who ever is in that area.

I think you have an idea for a whole new thing we can ask Dave for! An international "find ATP members" feature. Does Dave have our addresses? He might only be able to search for people who HAVE entered their address.

Addresses? That will be a controversy, I thought we were after climate, for that city should be enough. Aaaaaah! Now I get it.
Back to the drawing board or take the concept and change it. I think I am the only one showing the correct city and quite a few are giving false data. Sorry, I had not taken that into consideration.
Lynn any ideas around this?
Regards,
Arif.