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Jan 12, 2024 9:27 AM CST
Name: Derylin
Louisville ,Kentucky (Zone 6b)
Amaryllis Vegetable Grower Plant Lover: Loves 'em all! Peonies Irises Houseplants
Hibiscus Herbs Dog Lover Daylilies Cat Lover Region: Kentucky
I agree with you ,Daisy.Wide open standards are really a turn off for me.If I see that tendency from multiple pictures ,that iris is not coming to my garden.
However,this is my own personal dislike,and others may not think it is an issue for them.
And ,yes,there is a certain breeder that has been around a long time whose iris tend to have this trait more often than not.
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Feb 3, 2024 7:24 PM CST
Name: Marilyn, aka "Poly"
South San Francisco Bay Area (Zone 9b)
"The mountains are calling..."
Region: California Daylilies Irises Vegetable Grower Moon Gardener Dog Lover
Bookworm Garden Photography Birds Pollen collector Garden Procrastinator Celebrating Gardening: 2015
Daisy, as a former daylily garden judge (for a few years), I can confirm that "distinction" is one of the things that you are looking for in new seedlings.

"Distinction" covers a lot of ground, though. It includes notably better (as in exceptional) branching, budcount, period of bloom, time of bloom (as in season extenders), form (or a new variation in form), color or color pattern, and so on. Some things are easier to tell when you are standing in a garden looking at the plant in bloom, other things you have to ask around (from folks who locally grow it, as to what exceptional thing have they noticed over the season, like perhaps reliable early morning or cold morning opening or multiple rebloom cycles or exceptional heat tolerance in the bloom substance).

But here's the thing... Just because a plant has some novel distinction (new flower form, color, whatever), you aren't supposed to overlook other basic factors (health of the plant, bloom size in proportion to the scape/stalk height, bloom properly above the foliage (not down in it), decent enough budcount, good branching, and on and on). You just aren't.

But (speaking again of daylilies... I'm an eternal beginner when it comes to irises) that simply doesn't seem to be the case. Otherwise (imho) daylilies that are rust buckets wouldn't be getting awards. Or at least, they shouldn't be. And any that slip through with an H.M., definitely shouldn't go any farther.

So... something similar may be going on in the iris world. Shrug! Judges susceptible to a gee-wow factor. (Yeah, judges are human too.)
Evaluating an iris seedling, hopefully for rebloom
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Feb 3, 2024 9:25 PM CST
Los Altos, CA (Zone 9b)
Irises Region: Ukraine
"Distinctiveness" is actually the least important consideration in judging an iris:

From the AIS Judges' Handbook 2021

SCALE OF POINTS - Garden Judging of Tall Bearded Iris

1. Plant 30
a. Foliage 10
b. Durability/perennial qualities 15
c. Floriferousness 5

2. Stalk 35
a. Proportion 5
b. Strength 10
c. Branching 5
d. Bud Count & Bloom Sequence 15

3. Flower 25
a. Color 5
b. Form 10
c. Substance & Durability 10

4. Distinctiveness 10

TOTAL 100
Last edited by AndreaD Feb 3, 2024 9:30 PM Icon for preview
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Feb 3, 2024 10:37 PM CST
Name: Daisy
close to Baltimore, MD (Zone 7a)
Amaryllis Plant and/or Seed Trader Region: Maryland Peonies Organic Gardener Irises
Herbs Hellebores Growing under artificial light Container Gardener Cat Lover Garden Photography
Unfortunately, a lot of judges must need retraining on that point system, because quite a number of recent Dykes winners seem to be lacking good form in the standards. And that's supposed to be 10 points! Color is supposed to be only 5 points. And yet, color innovations have been taking the Dykes, despite poor form in the standards.

I love the award system, and many of the awarded cultivars are wonderful, but for the very highest awards, I am thinking that too many of the judges must be letting color carry them away.
-"If I can’t drain a swamp, I’ll go pull some weeds." - Charles Williams
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Feb 4, 2024 12:58 AM CST
Los Altos, CA (Zone 9b)
Irises Region: Ukraine
The thing I found very interesting about the judging standards was the importance of bud count and bloom sequence (15 points out of 35 for the stalk) versus branching (5 out of 35). I thought branching would be given more consideration in judging the stalk.
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Feb 11, 2024 10:22 PM CST
Name: Elsa
Las Cruces, New Mexico (Zone 8a)
Dog Lover Irises Region: New Mexico Region: Southwest Gardening Region: United States of America
Not a judge, just an Iris Aficionado. But, I love broken color and I love distinct patterns, but I also love selfs. I love variety, variety, variety. And I hate to say it but with regard to my own collection, I don't care that much how many bud counts it has or whether it has great branching, just that it blooms in any given year and I get to see it. If something has beautiful branching one year and never blooms again, it's beautiful branching is lost on me. But then again, I do see why branching can be a nice quality because it's beautiful for Show Irises and for those who like to do flower displays. Again, I consider it just one more addition to the vast variety Irises offer. A something for everyone offering.
Another thing to consider: When I have friends or family go through the garden in Spring, they are often drawn to the distinct patterns and unusual colors. The black ones are big hits. If I had a purple Iris that had perfect branching and lots of buds, they are not going to even notice it. And I am sure this goes on at display farms too. Sometimes that variety of color/patterns can really get someone who hasn't grown them before, excited about irises.
If you think there is no more beauty left in the world...Plant a garden!!!
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Feb 11, 2024 11:45 PM CST
Los Altos, CA (Zone 9b)
Irises Region: Ukraine
GreenIris said:
Another thing to consider: When I have friends or family go through the garden in Spring, they are often drawn to the distinct patterns and unusual colors. The black ones are big hits. If I had a purple Iris that had perfect branching and lots of buds, they are not going to even notice it. And I am sure this goes on at display farms too. Sometimes that variety of color/patterns can really get someone who hasn't grown them before, excited about irises.


Very good points! Visitors to my garden only notice the blooms!

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